Big Cam????

[Tom1200]

Looking at the cam card makes me think that cam has quite a bit of overlap, so I would expect it to behave exactly as you describe.

 

I ran a similar type of cam in my A12 and when the cam card says 5-7K they mean it. Getting the car on my tilt trailer involved a bunch of clutch slipping. 

 

Addtioanlly while I had to go up (richer) on the main jet I actually had to go 3 steps leaner on the pilot jet to get the car where it would pull through the 3500-5000 rpm range at part throttle.

 

My advice is go to a more street friendly cam, 5-9K is just crazy for a street car. You can't have the chugging along and then wham on the cam, then shift and chugga chugga chugga wham again. I run a cam that makes best power from 5-8K in my race car but it will still pull from 3000 rpm.

[scooter]

Theres more issues here. California datsun head is a red herring. Probably an old wrecker head with harbour freight punch marks on a stock cam.. even a stock l20b pulls past that... valve float or jetting me thinks.

 

unscrew the jets out of your weber and post them on here as well as your emulsion tubes and aux venturi diameter

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

Venturi diameter. Should be about 38mm for a street car.

 

Custom engine building is a term used to describe anything that requires math or mock-up or R&D. Tried and true parts in kit form are not something readily available for Datsun L motors. What I'm getting at is that you may want to dial it back a bit and get some advice from a veteran Datsun engine builder before sinking tons of time into this combination. I agree that the cam numbers look crazy for a street motor. I also agree that California Datsun does have a bad rep, enough so that I would have second thoughts about your setup.

 

The most basic question here is - what are your goals with this car? If you just want a fun weekend car and want to keep the 45's, maybe you would be happier with a smaller cam. You might also consider sending the head to someone like Rebello and have it checked out.

 

Custom engine building does require some advanced knowledge of how to do things like setting the cam timing and playing with your ignition timing curve. If you don't want to learn these things, then you may need to pay someone who knows how.

[hosestop@msn.com]

Who set up cam ? usually need 225-270 shims and set up to get angles right ,also valve lash changes per cam ,maybe 8 and 10 not 10 and 12 or 10 and 10 , my 2 cts.

[73DATSON]

25 minutes ago, hosestop@msn.com said:

Who set up cam ? usually need 225-270 shims and set up to get angles right ,also valve lash changes per cam ,maybe 8 and 10 not 10 and 12 or 10 and 10 , my 2 cts.

The head came set up with cam. 

[banzai510(hainz)]

Dude check the dist setting first. Espcially if the oil pump spindal was reinstalled or pulled. But if you only pull the dist out and put pack in it sould come out close to the same..

Your biggest 1st clue is the dist is crank fully to one side to get running.

2 clue  is Datsun Al.  ?????????? NBut really to set the head up is pretty ez once you have the correct size parts. Springs dont bind and the retainer lash pads set up correctly. It should run.

I dont know how to dereee a cam but I would put it on 2 or #3 on sprocket.  To dial it on one would have a multi hole cam sprocket to get the best power out of it.

 

personally you can still have a high lift cam but I would keep the duration around 270-280 as if one dont have a GOOD distributor(reworked one would be better or crank fire) you limitied at around 7K before they just cut out

[73DATSON]

1 hour ago, banzai510(hainz) said:

Dude check the dist setting first. Espcially if the oil pump spindal was reinstalled or pulled. But if you only pull the dist out and put pack in it sould come out close to the same..

Your biggest 1st clue is the dist is crank fully to one side to get running.

2 clue  is Datsun Al.  ?????????? NBut really to set the head up is pretty ez once you have the correct size parts. Springs dont bind and the retainer lash pads set up correctly. It should run.

I dont know how to dereee a cam but I would put it on 2 or #3 on sprocket.  To dial it on one would have a multi hole cam sprocket to get the best power out of it.

 

personally you can still have a high lift cam but I would keep the duration around 270-280 as if one dont have a GOOD distributor(reworked one would be better or crank fire) you limitied at around 7K before they just cut out

Yes on my to do list is the dizzy. I did remove the oil pump. I put in a new timing set in. As I was watching your video;-)

Now as for Cali Dat, I never had problems with the guy, so I can’t agree with some of you guys   Experience With him. That peanut head was in great condition, very clean, no Pitts. All of the  internals look new well greased or Oil?Bottom of the head  Not  warped. Over here on the East coast we don’t have many  option when it comes to buying Datsun Parts.  This car can sit in the back of my garage for years and it can still be running bad. This car is just to bring some good childhood memories for me. 

[73DATSON]

On 10/2/2018 at 9:12 PM, datzenmike said:

California Datsun???? ?

 

Measure the across the highest and the narrowest part of the cam lobe and subtract. Multiply this by 1.48 and that is the theoretical valve lift with zero lash.  O.592" is insanely high. Stock L20B is 0.413".

 

 

 

 

Hopefully it has the correct lash pads and the wipe pattern is centered on the rocker. You'll need some stiff valve springs to follow that lobe... your stock L series springs will stack around 0.480", in fact maybe your valves are floating at 4K.

 

I would have kept the U67 head for better breathing.

I will measure the cam, also to see if it’s what he said it is. 

 

4 hours ago, hosestop@msn.com said:

Who set up cam ? usually need 225-270 shims and set up to get angles right ,also valve lash changes per cam ,maybe 8 and 10 not 10 and 12 or 10 and 10 , my 2 cts.

 

[Crashtd420]

3 minutes ago, 73DATSON said:

Yes on my to do list is the dizzy. I did remove the oil pump. I put in a new timing set in. As I was watching your video;-)

Now as for Cali Dat, I never had problems with the guy, so I can’t agree with some of you guys   Experience With him. That peanut head was in great condition, very clean, no Pitts. All of the  internals look new well greased or Oil?Bottom of the head  Not  warped. Over here on the East coast we don’t have many  option when it comes to buying Datsun Parts.  This car can sit in the back of my garage for years and it can still be running bad. This car is just to bring some good childhood memories for me. 

The only good thing I think about California datsun is he uses a good shop to recondition the heads..... Al's a parts guy and really doesnt know much about what he sells..... with that said I bought a head from him and had zero issues with it..... 

Edited October 4, 2018 by Crashtd420

[73DATSON]

1 minute ago, Crashtd420 said:

The only good thing I think about California datsun is uses a good shop to recondition the heads..... Al's a parts guy and really doesnt know much about what he sells..... with that said I bought a head from him and had zero issues with it..... 

Yes he did said he’ll send out the head to be set up with the cam. It took like a months for me to receive it. 

[banzai510(hainz)]

Im sure its the dist now.  I even get it wrong installing the oil pump i just have a habit of getting  a tooth off.

do the screw driver test. right side of top hole left on bottom so its close to 11.28  as looking straight at it like a clock.

 

 

Edited October 4, 2018 by banzai510(hainz)

[73DATSON]

44 minutes ago, banzai510(hainz) said:

Im sure its the dist now.  I even get it wrong installing the oil pump i just have a habit of getting  a tooth off.

do the screw driver test. right side of top hole left on bottom so its close to 11.28  as looking straight at it like a clock.

 

 

If you could only see my pictures!?!? I believe mine is right under the  screw hole. Top and bottom 

[73DATSON]

1 hour ago, banzai510(hainz) said:

Im sure its the dist now.  I even get it wrong installing the oil pump i just have a habit of getting  a tooth off.

do the screw driver test. right side of top hole left on bottom so its close to 11.28  as looking straight at it like a clock.

 

 

I’m using my mobile to reply on the forum. When I get home I’ll post all the pictures from my PC. So u can see them. 

[distributorguy]

No stock head can breathe properly at those lift numbers.  Not even in the ballpark.  Our full race cam is a little bigger than that, and it required not only a full custom valvetrain to get the geometry correct, it requires different springs and about 100 hours of flow bench work to port it enough to utilize the cam.  Literally 2 red Solo cups full of material removed from the ports.  That cam wants 12:1 compression or higher to help make up for the drastic overlap at 314 duration.  Your cylinder cranking cylinder pressures are what?  110 psi?  That'll never draw fuel from the Webers appropriately.  The turbulence at 4k will also cause what you're experiencing.  Can it be made streetable?  Maybe with a custom distributor, and some severe carb rejetting.  

[banzai510(hainz)]

Going by what Dist guy said I could be right. You might go backwards,

retime motorand see how it runs.  if not as good I say put the old head back on.

 

just time it before anything else and dont respon back till you do this!!!!!!!!!

 

 

Edited October 5, 2018 by banzai510(hainz)

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

How would I handle this problem if the car were brought to my shop? I would start at ground zero.

 

1. check fuel level and condition
2. full inspection for obvious problems, leaks, worn cam, loose carbs, etc
3. check and set TDC
4. check and set valve adjustment
5. check and set cam timing
6. check distributor advance and function
7. check plug wires
8. check that carbs are getting full throttle, that mechanical snych is good, jets are tight and accel pumps are working. Also look for obvious problems in carbs like loose venturis, etc.
9. install new set of (correct) spark plugs
10. run and adjust carbs
11. road test and plug cut

If there was a problem, these basic steps would undoubtedly find it.

[datzenmike]

There was a guy who wanted the best for his car, and when the brakes were in need of replacement, went into the auto parts store and demanded the best brakes available. He was given many options but demanded the best stopping power, price was not an option. The latest high performance racing pads and shoes. Which is what he got and had put on. Much later after hours of high speed highway driving he pulled onto the exit ramp jammed on the brakes and promptly rammed into another car ahead of him. Unknown to him, as it turns out, the metallic pads, while providing superb stopping power, work better the hotter they are like on a race track. In the search for the best stopping power the car became unstoppable. Sometimes when going to extremes you have to compromise something else.

 

 

[john510]

3 hours ago, datzenmike said:

There was a guy who wanted the best for his car, and when the brakes were in need of replacement, went into the auto parts store and demanded the best brakes available. He was given many options but demanded the best stopping power, price was not an option. The latest high performance racing pads and shoes. Which is what he got and had put on. Much later after hours of high speed highway driving he pulled onto the exit ramp jammed on the brakes and promptly rammed into another car ahead of him. Unknown to him, as it turns out, the metallic pads, while providing superb stopping power, work better the hotter they are like on a race track. In the search for the best stopping power the car became unstoppable. Sometimes when going to extremes you have to compromise something else.

 

 

Pics or it didn't happen.

[Eriks]

On 10/2/2018 at 7:45 PM, banzai510(hainz) said:

 I have a 460/260 Schneider cam in my 521 and it shoulf have come stock in a L motor in my opinion

 

Hainz, in more detail how do you experience the Schneider 460 compared to stock cam?

[banzai510(hainz)]

IM only running a weber 32/36 on this and its not a lot of huge power. I had a 38/38on there it was better but I think the carb made more power if given a choice however the 38/38 is harder to start from a hill as you loose a lot of vacuum coming off idle.

The cost is buying new rockers and valve retainers and having the correct lash pads. I would go with a bigger  cam say a 475 lift . But if that whats available. But I stayed with this cam cause U run one stck valve spring and one aftermarket valve spring.  they say the outer spring binds or stacks up on itself at about .480. I went with this as its a daily driver and really don't eceed 5500rpms.

 

best is to run a 1.5 inch intake manifold and dual carbs, have the head intake poeted out to 1.5 if possible and all combined togetter will be better. But remember this is a small motor and youll spend 4times more to get 25% more power. L20 would be the ezeist and this the same as what I wrote to get the best power as its really just the same motor block just taller.

 

 

all this is my opinion . but your in a area that hasn't a lot of spart L motors lying around either . Just make what you have work as its just cool to see a old Datsun still on the road

Edited October 23, 2018 by banzai510(hainz)

[Eriks]

Thanks Hainz, I really appreciate your views. The reason I'm asking is that I do have a L20B, with 219 head with 1,5" intake, also dual SU carbs. But the cam is stock. Maybe I'm wrong, but I can not stop wondering if this package would benefit from a slightly more valve lift, while still be good as a daily driver.

Edited October 23, 2018 by Eriks

[banzai510(hainz)]

Long as the SUs work good I think you got a good set up already. to me your be lucky yo get anonther 5-8 hp to the ground with that cam and spend. about 300-500 more for cam and all the other stuff and stress of getting it to Norway.  I sent a front cover to a guy in Norway or maybe Finland and took like 2 months to get to him cause of customs.

 

all Schneider cams are now regrinds so the valve lash would be BIGGER than the say .160 I have installed on mine. 

 

maybe build a spare head on the side and when ready swap it out

[Eriks]

3 hours ago, banzai510(hainz) said:

 

Maybe build a spare head on the side and when ready swap it out

 

Good idea. Thanks ?

 

Edited October 23, 2018 by Eriks