Anyone actually installed 240Z aluminum drums on a 510?

[rosso]

Hi all,

 

I am slowly working on the rear brakes of my '72 510 goon. Has anyone actually installed the aluminum rear drums on a 510? What I have seen so far is that people have said you need to trim the 510 backing plate. Anyone BTDT?

 

Since trimming the backing plate on the car (and having it not looked hacked up) is probably beyond my tool ability. What about trimming the drums at a machine shop?

 

Here's the 240Z drum specs - and I will be staying with 13" wheels if I can work it out.

 

Extra cooling and would save as much as 3 pounds per drum.

 

 

Thoughts?

 

Thanks,

Michael

Edited September 9, 2018 by rosso
change weight savings

[Tedman]

Yes,  you need to trim the backing plates to run Z drums on a 510. My experience has been with sedans, and with the semi-trailing arms off the car (see pics). Perhaps having the drums machined might be easier than cutting the backing plates while still on the car (pay money, get parts) but it's not that hard to cut the lips off yourself with the right tools, or if you don't care how it looks, just judiciously bend the lips back with a pair of channel locks.   

 

 

 

 

 

[datsunwizard]

I machined a groove in the back side of the drums, no modifying of the backing plates needed. Did the job with a mill on a rotary table, basically copying the stock drums groove. Doing it this way retains the labyrinth seal, with keeps water, etc. out.

[rosso]

Thanks Tedman, I see you have a nice electric cutoff tool - and you did a great job trimming your backing plate. No way could I do that by hand.  ?

 

Datsunwizard, thanks, that is what I thought to do since I could have it done off the car by the local machine shop. Nice to hear that it is possible, and retain the double U seal. I hope it is not too expensive to machine since the aluminum drums are a bunch more expensive than stock 510.

Edited September 10, 2018 by rosso
changed shear

[banzai510(hainz)]

YOu think its really worth the hassle?

[rosso]

Hi Banzai,

 

Appreciate the input, that's what I am trying to decide. cost + hassle versus weight savings + extra cooling.

[rosso]

Update: I received the AC Delco bonded brake shoes and the friction material is shorter and in a different position. See photo.

What do you think about using these? AC Delco used to be a good brand for my American iron.  I have no idea what the old ones are. Or order another brand and hope for better?

 

Edited September 10, 2018 by rosso

[datzenmike]

They will work but the others are leading and trailing shoes. Properly installed, the position of the pad material and the turning direction of the drum, generates a servo effect and you get more braking with less effort. Ever backed up and noticed the it took more pedal pressure to get the same braking? They work best in the forwards direction where you need it most.

[rosso]

Hey datzenmike,

 

You mean the old ones are leading and trailing and the new ones are all the same so are universal fit but not as good?

 

On the new ones, all the friction surfaces are bonded in the same place on each shoe.

 

I am also concerned that the previous owner's installation had the shoes mounted incorrectly with both "small tongues" at the adjuster.

 

 

Or should it be this (disregard the red arrow, that was from a post about the adjuster)

 

like this was done

 

 

Thanks for all the help - just trying to figure it out to have good brakes - because VG33.  ?

 

 

[Icehouse]

I’ve just always smacked the dust ring off with a chissle and a hammer.  Doesn’t take long.  Although I’ve only done the upgrade on sedans.  

 

How did the drum fit with the AC Delco shoes?  All the local auto parts stores sell shoes that don’t fit!  I thought I was loosing my touch.  Then I decided to order some fancy shoes from Porterfield, wow they fit perfect.   No customization requires.  

[datzenmike]

 

 

Actually he may have both leading shoes on one side and trailing shoes on the other. Flipping the right one around so the lining is closer to the top would also work.

 

 

 

 

This looks like the proper way with vehicle front to the left.

[rosso]

Datzenmike,

 

Glad I took a picture of what I had (so I would know how to put it back together). Didn't count on it being done wrong. Thanks again for the info, I will put it as in the diagram and second photo.

 

Icehouse,

I didn't put the shoes back on since I didn't like that there was much less friction material and it was so differently orientated. The picture assembled was from another car and I wish that my shoes had as much material.

 

Where did you get your Porterfield shoes, when was that, and what did they cost? Thanks.

 

 

[Icehouse]

10 hours ago, rosso said:

 

Icehouse,

 

Where did you get your Porterfield shoes, when was that, and what did they cost? Thanks.

 

 

 

 

Me and the guys at work just used a set on our racecar (drums are a bad idea on a enduro car just for the record) You can just call them up and order them direct.  I think they are around 80 bucks for the rear shoes.  I seem to remember all four corners of my car shipped costing less then 200 shipped.  I get there street compound.  

[Tom1200]

I'm using a H190 out of a 510 wagon with Z alloy drums on my 1200 race coupe. When I got the set up someone had mixed up the shoes, it took me a little bit to figure out the leading shoe is the rear most one. Additionally the drums didn't quite clear the backing plates, the self clearances in about half a lap. 

 

In case anyone reads this thread while searching an issue, note FWD offset 13" wheels won't quite clear the cooling fins on the drums. The offset is to much by about 15mm. My Shelby wheels and Chevoit style have no issues.

 

The Poterfield R4-S shoes are $79 and you can order them direct.

 

[Ranman72]

it has been my experience that a stock 13 inch steel wheel will also not clear the finned drums

[datzenmike]

According to the Dime Quarterly they do. Vol. 4 issue1

[rosso]

On 9/15/2018 at 8:43 PM, Tom1200 said:

I'm using a H190 out of a 510 wagon with Z alloy drums on my 1200 race coupe. When I got the set up someone had mixed up the shoes, it took me a little bit to figure out the leading shoe is the rear most one. Additionally the drums didn't quite clear the backing plates, the self clearances in about half a lap. 

 

In case anyone reads this thread while searching an issue, note FWD offset 13" wheels won't quite clear the cooling fins on the drums. The offset is to much by about 15mm. My Shelby wheels and Chevoit style have no issues.

 

The Poterfield R4-S shoes are $79 and you can order them direct.

 

Hey Tom,

Do your Shelby 13" wheels look like these:

 

 

Mine are stamped Western Wheel on the backside.

 

Michael

[Tom1200]

Rosso mine are the fuax BBS look a like style; gold mesh center with bare alloy rim. 

 

I was was having clearance issue when I first fitted the H190 as its 3" wider than the standard 1200 H145. I tried the TRX style FWD when which resulted in the tires clearing the fenders but then the fins fouled the wheel. One could trim the fins, the 510 drums are so much bigger than the little 1200 brake drums that heat isn't a problem.