Anyone know much about 411s?

[datsunfreak]

Looking at buying one and need info. It's a '67 RL411 SSS. Are they all RL's or just the SSS models?

 

Anyone know any websites with info on them?

[ggzilla]

Tana is the expert, you can PM or email her ... most 411 don't have the R-engine.

[datsunfreak]

Tana is the expert, you can PM or email her ... most 411 don't have the R-engine.

 

Yeah, from what I've seen most are PL411's without the R16 engine. This is an RL4111 SSS with the R16, dual carbs, etc.

[ppeters914]

Hey, John, I have a '66 WPL411 w/ a L20b.

 

410's were built and sold 1964/65 with leftovers sold as '66's.

411's were built and sold 1966/67 with leftovers sold as '68's.

 

I figure less that 10,000 410/411's were imported into the US from 1964-68, so not a lot of 'em left.

 

PL410: 1200cc E-series engine

PL411: 1300cc J -series engine

RL411: 1600cc R16 engine same as roadster with several differences to fit into the 411.

 

The other main place 410/411 folks hang out, besides here, is the EarlyDatsunClub Yahoo Group.

 

No websites devoted to 410/411's....yet. I'm working on one.

 

No vendors either, although some of the parts Dean sells work on 411's.

 

Two folks on the EarlyDatsunClub have acquired a number of 410/411 parts: Tana Edwards (formerly Bryan) and Carl Hockett. Neither is online frequently plus Carl routinely has email issues.

 

Let me know if I can be of further assistance.

[datsunfreak]

I figure less that 10,000 410/411's were imported into the US from 1964-68, so not a lot of 'em left...

 

That's surprising since they sold nearly 50,000 510s in '68 alone, and nearly 400,000 over the entire model run (IIRC).

 

Now I would bet there are nearly as many 411s left as '68 510s. ;)

 

Let me know if I can be of further assistance.

 

Will do. Thanks!

[ppeters914]

I figure less that 10,000 410/411's were imported into the US from 1964-68, so not a lot of 'em left.

That's surprising since they sold nearly 50,000 510s in '68 alone, and nearly 400,000 over the entire model run (IIRC).

Well, the 410/411 Pininfarina styling was a major improvement

 

 

on the older copied-from-Austin style

 

 

but it wasn't a big seller in the US. Took Mr. K and the 510 before production and sales took off.

[datsunfreak]

Well, the 410/411 Pinafarelli styling was a major improvement...

 

Thought it was Pininfarina? :confused:

[ppeters914]

Yeah, I misspelled it, but wanted to get it posted before the forum LOGGED ME OFF!!!! I've gone back and edited it.

[MikeRL411]

The RL411 American export version was developed from the Japanese domestic SSS variant of the 411. The US Datsun factory race team wanted to get into Production Sedan Road Racing witout waiting for the 510 SSS to come out. They sent their lead mechanic to Yokohama to work out the mods needed to shorten the profile of the roadster 1600 type R engine to fit into the shorter engine compartment and also to cope with the left hand steering column. The resulting model was designated RL411 vs the parent PL411 [possibly as a shortcut P into R] and are separately numbered. The valve cover is beveled on the rear to fit into the space under the windshield, the waterpump, crankshaft pulley and alternator mounts are shortened an inch. The starter is original, but later "substitute" starters are for the 510 and won't work, they interfere with the pitman arm or frame. They do work in later Japanese market R411 which have the steering column on the right side. This info based on my discussions with the Datsun USA race team lead mechanic who supervised these mods. Until 5 years ago he worked at my local UNOCAL station and regrettably has since retired and moved away. Of course UNOCAL has also "retired". Original sales were of the homologation model with mimimal creature comforts to make them registrable yet all race parts were available over the counter and were bolt on or slip-in [transmissiion gear set] and would easily terrify BMWs.

[ppeters914]

Great info, Mike. You have that feller's name?

 

Sparky Pete on the EarlyDatsunClub Yahoo Group put together this list of the most obvious changes Nissan (and he US Datsun factory race team?) did to get the R16 to fit in the 411:

 

1) The RL oil pan is cast aluminum with fins. It has bulges that got it the nickname "Hammerhead" oil pans. The Roadster is stamped steel.

 

2) The water neck thermo housing has a regular 90-degree angle. The roadsters use an odd 3-piece assembly with a filler cap. NOTE: the 90-degree fitting is used by roadster folks when converting to the 2000 radiator.

 

3) The water pump and fan assemblies are different.

 

4) The intake manifold has an upward angle to clear the inner fender, and the carbs have the float chambers angled to match. Roadsters are horizontally level.

 

5) The distributor base has no tach drive connection nor external oil line, but the block does have the fitting with a plug. NOTE: I'm betting a stock roadster dizzy or the EI conversions will still work.

 

6) Different exhaust manifold to exit out the fender well hole. Will not fit a roadster.

 

7) Enclosed (Blue) air cleaner/silencer with snout at front.

[MikeRL411]

The mechanic's name was Duane, don't have his last name. Might find him through early race team photos. He had quite a few stories about how they hopped up 240Zs. "Its amazing what you can do with an engine that only has to last an hour and a half."

The "hammerhead" oil pan swell completely fills the space between the front cross member and the transmission. The fins do help cool the oil.

The exhaust manifold actually has an adapter section that converts the 2 manifold ports into a large single port and angles it for the fender hole. The gasket is unique, but 2 of the 510 gaskets will willingly sacrifice their lives to make an ersatz 411 adapter gasket.

The SSS air cleaner assembly was at one time listed in the NISMO catalog 16500-22000 for converting 510s to the SU carbs. Don't think any survive. The filter 16546-22000 is also unique, it's about an inch shorter than the roadster filter.

[MikeRL411]

A Kia Sephia thermostat housing fits just fine and is almost a visual clone. You just need to ream the metric bolt holes up to 3/8 to complete installation. A 1971 corporate Chrystler aluminum V6 housing will also do, its gasket is a perfect fit, Nissan doesn't stock the gasket. It may have a coolant temp sender mounted. Use it or pull and plug. The Chrystler/Dodge has an odd tilt to the outlet which would be fine for a roadster but makes me nervious in the RL411. It angles the hose too close to the fan for my comfort.