Ed-datsun521 Posted January 14, 2016 Report Share Posted January 14, 2016 Ground wire connector at fuel pump was loose ? No problems since then The actual connector that stews on to the pump was loose Anyways works great now yay ! 1 Quote Link to comment
GT2 Posted January 22, 2016 Report Share Posted January 22, 2016 Hi, so I'm building a tube frame race car with no existing wiring at all. I'm using a 87 na VG30e and engine harness. I will be getting a CA box. I think I have the wiring figured out but have a question. The CA box uses the wires from the stock main relay and the stock efi relay ( # 6 and # 114). Does this mean I can strip out the stock relays and their fusable link connection? Thanks, Tim Quote Link to comment
Icehouse Posted January 22, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 22, 2016 Yeah the can/am box replaces the stock fuses and relays. You should run a fuseable link for the power into the can/am box though. Quote Link to comment
GT2 Posted January 22, 2016 Report Share Posted January 22, 2016 Hi, so I'm building a tube frame race car with no existing wiring at all. I'm using a 87 na VG30e and engine harness. I will be getting a CA box. I think I have the wiring figured out but have a question. The CA box uses the wires from the stock main relay and the stock efi relay ( # 6 and # 114). Does this mean I can strip out the stock relays and their fusable link connection? Thanks, Tim Yeah the can/am box replaces the stock fuses and relays. You should run a fuseable link for the power into the can/am box though. I have another question about the speed sensor, do you think not having one will be a problem? I was reading up on it in the FSM and in the diagnostic section it says the ecu uses the speed sensor to see over/under 20 mph, it dosent say what the ECU does with this info. Any thoughts? ( Icehouse you have mail) Thanks, Tim Quote Link to comment
mhub91 Posted January 22, 2016 Report Share Posted January 22, 2016 Not sure about the VG, but I know 100% that the KA will run without the speed sensor input. HOWEVER, it will throw a code for it. Quote Link to comment
Chopper Posted January 23, 2016 Report Share Posted January 23, 2016 I just finished my VG30 installation into my dime. I will post up my complete wiring info in the next post. Jeff's box is a good addition to any conversion. No worries about the speed sensor. Quote Link to comment
Chopper Posted January 24, 2016 Report Share Posted January 24, 2016 Ok GT2 I will tell you what I did to get my Dime up and running with the VG30. Hi, so I'm building a tube frame race car with no existing wiring at all. I'm using a 87 na VG30e and engine harness. I will be getting a CA box. I think I have the wiring figured out but have a question. The CA box uses the wires from the stock main relay and the stock efi relay ( # 6 and # 114). Does this mean I can strip out the stock relays and their fusable link connection? Thanks, Tim I used a motor and harness from a 1984 300zx(z31) with an automatic. I sourced a trans, flywheel, etc from another z31. I would suggest that you find a copy of the 87 FSM to refer to. It will help to make things plain. If you don't have a copy I believe Icehouse has listed the link at the beginning of this topic. I initially stripped the harness of its wrap in order to make sure that I had identified each and every circuit and where each wire started and ended, and what it was spliced to. As I started to remove the original harness tape I replaced it with zip ties about every 12" or so. This way the harness remained intact, but all wires were visible and accessible. Next I identified every connector and labeled it so that if I wasn't using that circuit, input, or output I could remove it from the harness which streamlined installation. Many of the wires that you will need to connect to the CA box can be found at the yellow/white connector which ties into the body harness at the passenger side A pillar next to the ECU. For me I was able to remove at least 4 or 5 wires that connected the ECU to the automatic transmission lockup module that came through this connector. I also knew that I wanted to eliminate the EGR circuit. I traced both wires to the EGR solenoid (B/W, L/W). L/W terminates at the ECU pin4. I cut this wire at the ECU connector leaving enough to re-connect it if need be, put shrink tubing on the butt end and pulled it through the harness to the connector. I found where the B/W wire spliced in to the harness and cut it loose from the splice, then re-wraped the splice section. Since I was concerned about driveability and smooth idle and I wanted the engine to run as if it was original to my Dime like the factory would have intended I retained most of the idle circuits and controls. Some elect to remove these items from the intake manifold and use block off plates. You must then set the idle with the throttle plate screw and not have it controlled by the ECU. I did remove part of this circuitry though. The idle-up solenoid and FICD circuit adjust idle for increased engine load when the headlights are turned on, the A/C is on, and when P/S oil pressure is high(parking). I don't have any of these luxuries so the wiring to these "sensors" was removed from the harness...not the wiring to the idle-up/FICD valve. Again I cut these inputs at the ECU leaving enough wire to re-connect if necessary. Use common sense when removing wiring. I did, however leave this valve on the intake manifold as it incorporates the idle adjustment screw(basically an air bypass). I left the air regulator valve and circuitry intact as this controls the engines warm-up idle. The harness that came with my donor car had been modified by the dealership at some point in its life. There was an injector campaign to prevent engine fires from leaking injectors in the early 90's. Part of this campaign involved cutting and shrink wrapping the wiring to injectors 1,5,2,and 6. Then wiring 1,3,and 5 together, and 2,4,and 6 together... effectively changing the injectors that fired during batch mode. The VG ECU fires in (2) modes...simultaneous( above 3000rpm) and batch. This really didn't change much about how the car ran...but I wanted the computer to control the injectors....not the wiring change. So I re-wired the injectors individually per the FSM schematic. So lets get to powering this thing up. Follow the 88 z31 VG30E wiring diagram that Icehouse has provided. Lets start from the bottom....(1) connect the yellow wire from the large white/yellow connector to the starter solenoid, this goes to pin 9 at the ECU. (2) make sure that you properly ground the spots in the harness with ring terminals...grounding to the intake manifold(engine), and to the vehicle body, also run a proper ground strap from the motor to the chassis. (3) Remove the red wire from the fusible link harness connector or safety relay connector and connect it to ECCS BUP...this goes to ECU pin 114 and supplies hot to the injectors. (4) Remove the B/W wire from the EFI relay connector(usually green) and wire it to ECCS1...this goes to ECU pin 35,27. (5) Remove the red wire from the EFI relay connector and wire it to ECCS LSS...this goes to ECU pin 6. (6) Pickup the G/W wire where it would have connected to the fuse panel....this should connect the ignition coil and ECU pin 34 to RUN1 on the CA box (on the 87 on it also powers the O2 sensor and air regulator)....for the 84-85 harness hook the L/W wire from the fuse box to RUN2(this powers the O2 and air regulator on these earlier years). (7) Secure a good ground for the GRD terminal on the CA box. (8) Connect ignition power to KEY PWR on the CA box( B/W wire from the original 510 fuse panel). (9) This is where things get a little interesting.....Nissan controlled the Fuel Pump on the z31 and s12 VG30 by using ground through the ECU. The CA box controls "power" not ground and works well for all the other Nissan engine configurations except the early VG30. I wanted my car to have the ECU control the fuel pump operation as it did from the factory. In order to accomplish this I removed the FP relay from the CA box and wired a stand alone relay that functioned as the factory intended. I used a standard Bosch relay with (2) 87 terminals(not an 87 and 87a)much like a headlight relay. I connected 86 to ignition hot and positive side of the fuel pump...you can pick up ignition power at the previous FP relay plug on the CA box...check with a test light, 85 to Y/B to pin 20 at the ECU, 30 to ground, and 87 to fuel pump neg. and the other 87 to B(pin 108 at the ECU. If you wire the fuel pump using the CA box the pump will not prime with key on, it will run during cranking and the engine will start, but it will shut off after 30sec of run time, and then not prime on shut-off. I will provide pictures tomorrow if I can dig through 2' of snow to get to the garage. Good luck and let me know if you have any more questions....I have a ? for you....What group do you plan on running this setup with...SCCA? 1 Quote Link to comment
GT2 Posted January 24, 2016 Report Share Posted January 24, 2016 "Good luck and let me know if you have any more questions....I have a ? for you....What group do you plan on running this setup with...SCCA?" I'm preparing the car for SCCA GT3, but will initially be running test and tune days at Spokane (WA) raceway, then racing with ICSCC, then eventually maybe some SCCA events. (cant figure out how to post a pic from photo bucket,it keeps adding my whole album) Thanks for your wiring to the dime post. I had the same thoughts about the fuel pump control that you did, however after reading in the FSM how the ecu varied the voltage to the fuel pump I decided that was probably not what I needed for a pure race application. I think full voltage all the time would be better for me. The one thing I dident get on the donor car was the coil and coil wiring. That is something I have to get soon and figure out how to wire it in. Thx Tim Quote Link to comment
GT2 Posted January 25, 2016 Report Share Posted January 25, 2016 Chopper, I just re read your wiring. So are you saying if I use CA box for fuel pump that after 30sec run time it will die? Quote Link to comment
Chopper Posted January 25, 2016 Report Share Posted January 25, 2016 Chopper, I just re read your wiring. So are you saying if I use CA box for fuel pump that after 30sec run time it will die? Thats correct. As it is indicated in the wiring diagram provided in this topic. Nissan had the z31 and s12 VG ECU control the ground side of the fuel pump. Different from the way the ECU controls the power side of the fuel pump on the CA, KA, and SR engines. The voltage to the pump was varied most likely through change in resistance of the ground. I would assume the lower voltages were used to lean the mixture for cruise efficiency. If you look at the FSM it provides the fuel pump circuit diagram showing the ECU controlling the ground as well as the conditions under which the voltage to the pump is varied. I would suspect that the ECU provides full ground by activating the fuel pump relay(providing ground to the FP relay coil through pin 20) closing the contact and making a full ground....then as cruise is reached the relay is turned off and ground is switched to pin 108 which must have varied resistance to control voltage. Your needs are much different from a typical street driven vehicle. I would think that you want to monitor fuel pressure with a sender and gauge. Also quite possibly replace the stock pressure regulator with an adjustable style like one from Aeromotive. Individual cylinder EGT's. That way exhaust temps could be maximized for HP. It may even be best to invest in a complete controller from someone like Electramotive...when you sort things at the dyno then changes can be made more easily. Giving Dave Rebello a call or Dave Auerbach if he's still around may get you pointed in the right direction. What are the guys running this motor doing for engine management? The CA box although a great product might not be the right choice for your application. Keep us posted. Quote Link to comment
GT2 Posted January 25, 2016 Report Share Posted January 25, 2016 Yes most race apps use an after market management. Budgetary constraints dictate I use a stock ecu while building the car. If I run the fuel pump on a completely separate circuit, does the ecu still need to see some sort of signal from it? Thx Quote Link to comment
Chopper Posted January 25, 2016 Report Share Posted January 25, 2016 Yes most race apps use an after market management. Budgetary constraints dictate I use a stock ecu while building the car. If I run the fuel pump on a completely separate circuit, does the ecu still need to see some sort of signal from it? Thx Looking at the circuitry I would say no. You should be able to run the fuel pump separate from the ECU. If you choose to use the CA box then you would need to just wire up a switch that connects terminal 85 of the relay(FPLSS) direct to ground, FP1 to positive side of the pump, ground the pump negative to the chassis. That should activate the relay separate from the ECU. Love to see some pictures of your build Quote Link to comment
GT2 Posted January 25, 2016 Report Share Posted January 25, 2016 Pic of rolling chassis with body loosely hung. [/url]">http://http://s63.photobucket.com/user/t3lh/media/race%20car/GetFileAttachment.jpg.html'> Quote Link to comment
Chopper Posted January 25, 2016 Report Share Posted January 25, 2016 Pic of rolling chassis with body loosely hung. [/url]">http:// That looks like a familiar car. I crewed for Fletcher Williams for several years during much of the 90's. He campaigned a 240sx out of the South East and was a constant figure on the GT3 SCCA Runoffs grid for 15 yrs with that car. Best Runoffs finish was on the podium in 3rd place in 98, 4th in 97, and 5th in 07. I spent several years under the Nissan tent at the Runoffs.....lots of successful Nissan history there. You need to document your build and race results on this forum...looking forward to your updates...I wish you much success. Quote Link to comment
GT2 Posted January 25, 2016 Report Share Posted January 25, 2016 That looks like a familiar car. I crewed for Fletcher Williams for several years during much of the 90's. He campaigned a 240sx out of the South East and was a constant figure on the GT3 SCCA Runoffs grid for 15 yrs with that car. Best Runoffs finish was on the podium in 3rd place in 98, 4th in 97, and 5th in 07. I spent several years under the Nissan tent at the Runoffs.....lots of successful Nissan history there. You need to document your build and race results on this forum...looking forward to your updates...I wish you much success. That body was/is very popular on the west coast both in SCCA and NASPORT ( now defunct?) . I've been to the runoffs a few times with my friend Ken Muth, he has a s13 240- GT2 car. I dont have my CA box yet and was wondering about hooking up my ignition on/off toggle switch. Does it hook to the CA box "ground" terminal? Also my starter button, does it hook to the CA box "key power" terminal? Quote Link to comment
Chopper Posted January 26, 2016 Report Share Posted January 26, 2016 I dont have my CA box yet and was wondering about hooking up my ignition on/off toggle switch. Does it hook to the CA box "ground" terminal? No, please connect the ignition on/off to the KEY PWR terminal on the CA box, Make sure that you fuse the switch between the battery and the switch. Connect the ground terminal on the CA box to a good body/chassis ground. Also my starter button, does it hook to the CA box "key power" terminal? No, please connect the starter button/solenoid using the yellow wire to pin 9 at the ECU, this wire can be found/picked up at the large yellow/white connector in the harness near the ECU. Quote Link to comment
GT2 Posted January 26, 2016 Report Share Posted January 26, 2016 No, please connect the ignition on/off to the KEY PWR terminal on the CA box, Make sure that you fuse the switch between the battery and the switch. Connect the ground terminal on the CA box to a good body/chassis ground. Also my starter button, does it hook to the CA box "key power" terminal? No, please connect the starter button/solenoid using the yellow wire to pin 9 at the ECU, this wire can be found/picked up at the large yellow/white connector in the harness near the ECU. So just to be clear, I take + power at the battery thru a fuse to a toggle switch and connect it to the key power CA terminal. Looking at the VG / CA wiring diag. It would appear that permanently grounding the CA box would keep the # 34 pin energized all the time? The #9 pin in the ecu does not activate the starter solenoid, so I assume you mean take + power at the battery thru a fuse to one side of momentary push switch. Then connect the #9 wire and another wire to the other side of the switch then on to the starter solenoid? Thx Tim Quote Link to comment
GT2 Posted January 26, 2016 Report Share Posted January 26, 2016 Looking at the VG / CA wiring diag. It would appear that permanently grounding the CA box would keep the # 34 pin energized all the time? Thx Tim So I went back thru the posts and think I understand the Key power/ ground circuit. In the vg/ca diagram If you label the B/W old 510 wire as " key power" it starts to make sense ( to me anyway because I dont have a 510). Sound correct? Quote Link to comment
Chopper Posted January 26, 2016 Report Share Posted January 26, 2016 So just to be clear, I take + power at the battery thru a fuse to a toggle switch and connect it to the key power CA terminal. Correct, just like an ignition key switch would do, only you don't need a key...just a switch on your panel Looking at the VG / CA wiring diag. It would appear that permanently grounding the CA box would keep the # 34 pin energized all the time? The coil side of the RUN relay gets its power from the ignition switch....so the switch side of the relay doesn't work until you flip the ignition switch thus providing power to pin 34 at the ECU and the other items on that circuit...the O2 sensor, idle air regulator, and the ignition coil. You must pickup this wire G/W where it would have originally connected to the fuse box. If you don't have the pigtail for the ignition coil and transistor from the original harness then you can pick up this G/W wire at the large yellow/white connector. That way you will include O2 and idle air as well as the ECU....You will then need to splice in a wire for the coil to that circuit. The #9 pin in the ecu does not activate the starter solenoid, so I assume you mean take + power at the battery thru a fuse to one side of momentary push switch. Then connect the #9 wire and another wire to the other side of the switch then on to the starter solenoid? Correct...The ECU needs to see a "Start" signal thats why we connect the start switch/solenoid to it through pin 9. This can be done with a wire from the starter button(where the start signal originates) or with a wire from the starter solenoid at the other end of the wire(where the start signal terminates) So your control panel should have at least (4) switches....(1) master power, (2) ignition, (3) starter push(momentary), (4) fuel pump( this is a ground switch that connects the fuel pump relay at the CA box (FPLSS) to ground)....no hot wire to this switch. Quote Link to comment
GT2 Posted January 27, 2016 Report Share Posted January 27, 2016 Chopper thanks for your help! I picked up a coil/power transistor and got all that wiring figured out. However I cant seem to find where the wire for the distributor condenser goes in the harness. Any ideas? Quote Link to comment
marky510 Posted January 31, 2016 Report Share Posted January 31, 2016 Hey Everyone, I'm in the middle of wiring my sr20de s14 non-turbo into my wpl312. Found some inconsistencies in the info I have gathered that I was hoping someone could help sort out for me. So this is what I have, Icehouse's CAN AM box, my ECU is a WA #23710-65F00 A18-000 G50 and using this diagram Here's my issues: On run1 and run2 of the CAN AM box are brown and black/red harness wires both 12v positive. My brown harness wires are tied together and go to the 3 wire O2 sensor plug and the VVT solenoid plug no big deal. The problem arises with the black/red wire on the O2 sensor that is tied into the run2 on CAN AM box and goes to pins 36 and 109 on ECU plug. So.... is brown actually supposed to be 12v or a ground. O2 sensor should have 12v, ground and white signal to ECU. Also, CAN AM box FP2 shows black/yellow to Air Regulator, my motor does not have a regulator just IACV and a/c idle up solenoid. IACV wires are light blue and black/yellow. Secondary questions for clarification. The VVT solenoid has 2 wires, brown and yellow. Assuming brown is ground, is yellow wire pulse width modulated power by ECU? And is the IACV ground side modulated by light blue wire? Thanks for any help is great appreciated, Mark Quote Link to comment
DLXV Posted February 5, 2016 Report Share Posted February 5, 2016 Okay so this might be a dumb question but I don't really understand wiring that well. Is the wiring for these boxes Ting into the ecu harness? Like should I just cut off a section of insulation and solder my wire in? Or are you just wiring straight from the plugs and sensors into the box and not using the part that comes from the ecu? Quote Link to comment
Icehouse Posted February 5, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2016 Hook the CAN/AM box into these plugs don't cut anything off the ecu. 1 Quote Link to comment
DLXV Posted February 5, 2016 Report Share Posted February 5, 2016 Okay so I'm just Ting into those plugs? Sorry I'm not understanding how they hook in. 1 Quote Link to comment
Ed-datsun521 Posted February 6, 2016 Report Share Posted February 6, 2016 Just tap it in tap tap tapperu 1 Quote Link to comment
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