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orizatlan

1985 Kingcab Nissan gas swap to SD22 Diesel engine

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Alright! I thought the white connectors were the fusible links and i was like...???... that looks like a connectore. And i even checked continuity across them. But know that i have seen the picture it makes sense.Thanks for the clarification.

 

PROGRESS! It was just the battery.haha. I know! So i put in a bigger battery with about 750CCR and this one was able to turn it. I am so excited. And yes, i did turn it by hand. That is why i was so stumped when i was tryiing to push start her. Anyways, i got the engine turning and it moves smooth. A friend of mine thought to put starter fluid so we did that and guess what it almost started. So we immedeatly loosened the no.1 injector to see if it squirted as we cranked. We did not. So now i am thinking that it may be the arm controller on the pump. When i move the ignition to the ON position, SOMETIMES the pump moves into place. Sometimes it does nothing.

 

Also, i have switched out 3 glow plug relay and still cannot get hot glowplugs. But i am getting closer.

 

MAN , when i get this thing on i am gonna run her for hours!

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If my fusible link was blown,

 

What kind of amps could i put inline instead of just straight bypassing? 15, 25?

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As I said, everything goes threw them 4 fusible links, the glow plugs are one of them, the ign. is one of them, you need good power or nothing is going to work properly in all 4 wires, if you are not warming the glow plugs, then you don't have power to them, the glow plug power is one of the black(fusable link) to white(main harness) wires, the red wire goes to the headlight switch, and the white black goes to the ignition switch, one of the white wires goes to the glow relay, and the other goes to the fuse block, IP controller and the DPC module.

If you have to, touch a big wire from the positive battery post to number 4 glow plug for about 30 seconds, since they are all connected by the one wire, they will all warm up at once, then turn it over for 30 seconds, and then repeat over and over till it starts.

Since I am not there, I cannot see what is going on, so I am trying to type it down, but I am sure I am forgetting things.

The engine controller which is the thing/motor below the injection pump that moves the pump arm into the proper position when starting, running and shutting off the engine does not move till the engine is cranking/turning over, then it will go to the start position, it doesn't move when the ignition is turned on, but to get it started, remove the arm from the injection pump and let it move to the middle position, then expect to turn the engine over for quite a while before the engine even tries to start.

In the past I have removed all the injection lines and turned it over till the outlets started squirting fuel up at the hood, then I put the injection lines on and turned it over more till the lines filled up, but this was done this way as I was using a unknown pump.

You just have to turn it over for half a minute, and then let the starter cool off.

Don't use starting fluid, it is bad for your engine, since you seen it try to start with that fluid, now just let it start the way it's supposed to start.

Did you fill the spin on fuel filter with diesel to the top, did you pump the primer for a long time with it resisting you?

You cannot fill your injection lines with the primer, that has to be done by turning it over.

Beleave it or not, it's easier to turn the engine over in first going 10 mph, than going 30mph and trying to start it in 3rd.

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Wayno! I got it running. On Saturday i decide to bring her home and as i was towing it i decided to throw it in gear again. This time it turned the motor and started chuggin. 15 seconds later it turned on. By this time i had emptied the diesel and put 2 fresh gallons and a new filter. I also realized that the reason it may not have turned the first time is because the clutch may have been stuck and as i heated it up it loosed. NEWays, the point is it turned on and it smokes like crazy.

 

I read your post,

http://community.ratsun.net/topic/36924-sd22-diesel-engine-issues/

and this is exactly whats happening to me.It initially smoked gray. So as i got up to operating temp, i shut it off and gave it an oil change. Started her back up and saw an improvement. Smokes white now. This led me to believe that there is a ring problem but there is power. This engine was supposedly rebuilt 21K ago. I have also suspected stuck rings since its been sitting for 5+ years. So after reading your thread i guess i am going to check the pump timing and mess with the smoke screw. Any advice? After that i am going to change the pump out with on of the other ones that i have.

 

Other facts: the engine sounds great and has excellent response.

Also, i ran out of gas about after an hour of idling. WIth 2 gallons. This also leads me to believe there maybe a waste of fuel some place.

 

Thanks all! Stay tuned for the pictures of my little forest fire. Keep in mind we are recycling and there is a green side to that.=)

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I would not mess with the pump timing if it was where it was stock, there are a lot of reasons why it will smoke when started, glow plug/plugs not good this will cause a gray/white smoke that comes out in puffs, which is un-burnt fuel, plugged injector, low compression for whatever reason, bad injection pump, lots of reasons I don't even know.

Give it some time, you cannot adjust out gray/white smoke that I know of.

There is smoke that is black, that is an engine running rich, that can be adjusted out with the smoke screw, do you know where the smoke screw is?

This is an injection pump.

DSCN0099.jpg

This is your mechanical governor.

DSCN0098.jpg

This is the smoke screw, it is there to adjust the black smoke out.

DSCN0100.jpg

If you are dumping diesel somewhere, you will smell it, it's an unmistakable odor/smell, if you are smoking gray/white badly, you are basicly puking un-burnt fuel out the tail pipe which also smells bad.

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What if i only have start and stop function on my pump controller? When it starts, if it continues to stay in the start position, which in the manual indicates excessvie fuel, could this be the reason it smokes so much. If so, when does the pump move to the run positon? Like it is based on time or heat. I am going to try to move it manually and see if there is any iprovement.

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The controller will move to the run position when you are no longer engaging the starter.

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What if i only have start and stop function on my pump controller? When it starts, if it continues to stay in the start position, which in the manual indicates excessvie fuel, could this be the reason it smokes so much. If so, when does the pump move to the run positon? Like it is based on time or heat. I am going to try to move it manually and see if there is any iprovement.

 

Depends on the color of the smoke, only black smoke is rich as far as I know, any other color would be some other issue.

See in the photos below how the smoke is gray, this is an issue, I removed this engine as I could not fix it.

 

DSCN0700.jpg

 

DSCN0701.jpg

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Hey all, Its been a crazy month and i have wanted to document the progress but havnt because i like to post with pictures. So even though i am not done id like to give update and give some lessons learned so far.

 

Since i got the 82 running, i have still not been able to figure out why it smokes so much. So i started preparing the 85 donor/gasser.

 

I pulled the diesel engine.

 

Grinded out the angle irons on the 82 where the motor mounts bolt on to.

 

Pulled the gas engine and trans.

 

Welded on the angle iron onto the gasser, BECAUSE THE MOUNTS DO NOT BOLT UP. Although there was something that i did not try that may work. The angle irons on the gasser had a different bolt pattern. The diesel mount did not match up or sit right because of the pin positioner.

WHAT I COULD HAVE DONE is just make 3 hole. Two for the bolts and one for the pin. Then slip a nut behind the angle iron and just bolt up.

But whats done is done.

What i did instead was bolt on the angle irons that i grinded out of the diesel frame and dropped it into my gasser. i marked where it sat, then took the engine out and welded. I have to say that i am very proud for having welded it right. Everything lined up.

 

I dropped the engine and trans into the donor.

 

Pulled the gas harness

 

Installed the diesel harness

 

 

Lessons learned:

1. I would argue the the gas tank and the diesel tank are the same. I changed them out but look exactly the same. Even the lines. Unless there is some metallurgical difference that some one can show engineering specification im guessing they are the same.

2. Drop the engine and trans as one piece.

3.Integrate the diesel components( glow plug/relay/timer, and DCP and arm controller) into the gas harness. Why? I lost my A/C, power windows, defrost, radio, and other components. Now i have to back and wire individually and integrate them into my diesel harness. I studied the wiring diagrams for the diesel and the gasser and the everything is COLOR CODED. It can be done. It would save you from taking off the dash and making a mess in an other wise perfectly wired system.

 

More to come

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Hey all, Its been a crazy month and i have wanted to document the progress but havnt because i like to post with pictures. So even though i am not done id like to give update and give some lessons learned so far.

 

Since i got the 82 running, i have still not been able to figure out why it smokes so much. So i started preparing the 85 donor/gasser.

 

I pulled the diesel engine.

 

Grinded out the angle irons on the 82 where the motor mounts bolt on to.

 

Pulled the gas engine and trans.

 

Welded on the angle iron onto the gasser, BECAUSE THE MOUNTS DO NOT BOLT UP. Although there was something that i did not try that may work. The angle irons on the gasser had a different bolt pattern. The diesel mount did not match up or sit right because of the pin positioner.

WHAT I COULD HAVE DONE is just make 3 hole. Two for the bolts and one for the pin. Then slip a nut behind the angle iron and just bolt up.

But whats done is done.

What i did instead was bolt on the angle irons that i grinded out of the diesel frame and dropped it into my gasser. i marked where it sat, then took the engine out and welded. I have to say that i am very proud for having welded it right. Everything lined up.

 

I dropped the engine and trans into the donor.

 

Pulled the gas harness

 

Installed the diesel harness

 

 

Lessons learned:

1. I would argue the the gas tank and the diesel tank are the same. I changed them out but look exactly the same. Even the lines. Unless there is some metallurgical difference that some one can show engineering specification im guessing they are the same.

2. Drop the engine and trans as one piece.

3.Integrate the diesel components( glow plug/relay/timer, and DCP and arm controller) into the gas harness. Why? I lost my A/C, power windows, defrost, radio, and other components. Now i have to back and wire individually and integrate them into my diesel harness. I studied the wiring diagrams for the diesel and the gasser and the everything is COLOR CODED. It can be done. It would save you from taking off the dash and making a mess in an other wise perfectly wired system.

 

More to come

 

 

If you contact "calhoon520", he might tell you how he made his diesel mini harness, as he made one for his 520 diesel project, that way you can use your gasser wiring harness for the rest of the truck, I have never had a all electric 720(windows, ect.), so I just use the diesel harnesses for the ease of it, no headaches, and everything works.

I have been told that the diesel tanks are differant on the inside, gasser tanks are galvanized on the inside, the diesels are not???, this has been discussed quite a bit over the years.

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HEY GUYS, I WAS BROWSING THE NET AND CAME ACROSS THIS POST. PULLING THE WIRING HARNESS FROM THE DIESEL IS GOING WAY TO FAR. I HAVE DONE 3 OF THESE CONVERSIONS, AND IT IS NOT NECESSARY. THINGS TO CONSIDER:

ALL THE TEMP, OIL, AND AMP GAUGES WORK BASICALLY THE SAME. YOUR PUMP IS MECHANICAL, ALL THE PCM DOES IS CUT IT OFF AND ON. YOU HAVE A TRUE 12 VOLT GLOW PLUG SYSTEM. IT IS NOT A 6V PLUG LIKE ON THE ISUZUS. AND RABBITS.

ALL YOU HAVE TO DO IS CAREFULLY MARK YOUR MAIN WIRES TO THE TEMP, OIL, ETC. COMPONENTS ON THE GAS ENGINE. MARK THE PRIMARY IGN. WIRE TO THE COIL FOR A PRIMARY WIRE IF YOU NEED IT AND IF YOU HAVE A 85 IT HAS AN ELEC. FUEL PUMP YOU CAN STILL USE TO TRANSFER THE DIESEL WITH.

 

EVERY SWAP I HAVE DONE, I PLACED THE ENGINE AND TRANS TOGETHER. HOOKED UP THE DRIVE SHAFT, INSTALLED THE CROSS MEMBER, LOWERED THE ENGINE WITH MOUNTS ATTACHED DOWN ON TO THE GAS FRAME AND SPOT WELDED IN 3 LOCATIONS. IF MOUNT GOES BAD, NO PROB A DIE GRINDER AND A FRESH WELDING ROD WONT FIX. AS YOU INSTALL YOUR DIESEL COMPONENTS, YOU WILL FIND THAT FOR EVERY PLACE A GAS BURNER MOUNT HAS A HOLE IN THE ENGINE BAY, THE DIESEL COMPONENTS MOUNT BACK IN THE SAME PLACE. AS FOR THE GLOW PLUGS, GET A PUSH BUTTON, A OLD MODEL FORD STARTER RELAY, 2 GOOD HEAVY BATTERY CABLES, AND SOME CUTTING PLIERS. SELF EXPLANATORY. FOR THE FUEL PUMP: I HAVE OPERATED ALL OF MINE OFF OF A PUSH PULL CABLE. PRIMITIVE I KNOW, BUT THIS IS HOW ALL OF THE IH SCOUTS WITH THE SD33 DIESEL WORK. DONT MAKE IT ANY HARDER THAN IT HAS TO BE. ITS BASICALY A TRACTOR WITH A CAB. MY DAILY DRIVER IS A 85 SWB I PLACED A 81 DIESEL IN. KEEP THE GAS FUEL TANK, DRAIN IT OF COURSE, SWAP YOUR BELL HOUSINGS IF YOU DONT ALREADY HAVE A TRANNY, KEEP THE GAS REAREND. I AVERAGE 38-42 MPG AT 65 MPH AND THE TRUCK HAS NO STRAIN AT ALL.

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Personally I want to turn the engine on/off with a key, and I want to start it when the light goes out.

If the diesel scout came with a choke cable to turn the engine on/off from a factory, I can understand why they are not in business anymore, that's what people do when they don't have money, or don't want to do it properly in the first place, there is no way a diesel maxima came with a choke cable to start it and shut it off.

 

I have got 36mpg going 60-65mph, that is the best I have ever done, but all my diesel trucks are kingcabs.

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first off the only reason IH quit making trucks was the EPA emission reg. Its hard to regulate the emissions of a 6500 lbs 1/2 ton class truck. They still manufacture 1-1/2 ton rated trucks and above. The reason they came with a pull cable to shut the fuel off was the type of pump nissan had supplied with the sd33. It did not have a pcm. I believe everyone would agree that im not short cutting im simplifying the swap. my shop is not a Nissan plant and my daily drive has served me very well for 8 years it works fine. Im stating the fact that the average joe can do this and it is not a big task.

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The diesel nissan maxima came with everything needed to start and shut down the SD33 diesel engine with a key, anything else is a short cut, if that short cut was done by a manufacturer to make the scout, then they should not be making them.

I am positive the diesel nissan maxima came with a DPC module(injection pump control unit), engine controller, and a glow plug timer, and the wiring harness to control them, or something that does the same thing that these parts do, anything else screams backyard mechanic.

I suggested that orizatlan should contact another member here that has made a diesel mini harness, so he can have a truck that works properly without using the diesel harness if that helps keep his ST harness with all the bells and whistles, and that is not I quote, "WAY TO FAR".

I have done at least 3 gas to diesel conversions in 720s, and all have worked properly, with a key, and if a choke cable/button is professional, that is something I will never be.

I usually get along with most people, but this stuff drives me crazy, to me this is like a toggle switch to turn on the ignition, sure it works, but one day it can come back and bite you in the ass.

I have seen lots of 720 diesels for sale with choke cables, and owners describing how to start the truck, you know there are 3 positions for the injection pump you are describing, start, run, and off, not one of these fellows knew this, I wonder if the scout had a sticker on the dash describing the 3 positions, a sticker is a hell of a lot cheaper than doing it right with a wiring harness and components.

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AFTER READING THE PREVIOUS FEW POST AND REPLYS BACK TO MY POST 3 THINGS CAME TO MIND. 1 PARTICULAR MEMBER IN THE IS FORUM CANNOT TAKE ANYONE ELSES THOUGHTS ABOUT A PROJECT WITHOUT GETTING THEIR PANTIES ( SOORY LADIES) IN A WAD. JUST BECAUSE YOU TAKE A WIRING HARNESS OF ONE TRUCK AND PUT IT ON ANOTHER DOES NOT MAKE YOU A "DATSUN MECHANIC" THAT MEANS YOUR TO DAMN LAZY OR STUPID TO INCORPORATE YOUR OWN WIRE HARNESS INTO YOUR NEW TRUCK. THE PCM AND GLOW PLUG SYSTEM CAN BE HARD WIRED IN ALSO IVE DONE IT BEFORE NOT HARD. LIKE WAS POSTED HERE PREVIOUSLY, ITS COLOR CODED! GET A SCHEMATIC. 2 YOUR JUST A DUMBASS AND DONT KNOW SHIT ABOUT NISSAN DIESELS OR FOR THAT FACT ANY DIESELS. MAXIMAS CAME OUT WITH A LD28 DIESEL. SCOUTS CAME OUT WITH A SD33 INDUSTRIAL DIESEL. THE SD33 WAS OFFERED A TURBO THE LD28 WAS NOT IN THE USA. THE PUMPS ARE DIFFERENT YOU IDIOT.. THE LD28 HAS A PCM THE SD33 DOES NOT. NO JEEP, SCOUT, FORKLIFT,STATIONARY MOTOR OR SAILBOAT CAME WITH A PCM. IT IS AN INDUSTRIAL ENGINE HENCE "SD" SEVERE DUTY. "LD" LIGHT DUTY. THEY HAD TO PUT SD22 IN NISSAN TRUCKS BECAUSE OF THE WAY WE DRIVE OVER HERE. I GUESS A "DATSUN MECHANIC" WOULD KNOW THIS. 3 YOUR JUST A FUNNY A FUNNY GUY. YOU CALL YOUR SELF "DATSUN MECHANIC". ALL BS ASIDE IM SURE YOUR A GOOD GUY AND A DESCENT MECHANIC. YOU HAVE TO BE TO KEEP THIS SCRAP IRON RUNNING. ALL I WAS SAYING IS YOU DONT HAVE TO START FROM A POINT, GO 4 MILES DOWN THE ROAD TAKE A RIGHT GO 50 FEET, TURN RIGHT AGAIN GO 400 FEET AND THEN TURN LEFT. JUST TAKE A RIGHT AND GO 50 FEET. DONT MAKE IT HARDER THAN IT HAS TO BE..

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Wow....ALL CAPS RAGE! Calm down buddy!

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AFTER READING THE PREVIOUS FEW POST AND REPLYS BACK TO MY POST 3 THINGS CAME TO MIND. 1 PARTICULAR MEMBER IN THE IS FORUM CANNOT TAKE ANYONE ELSES THOUGHTS ABOUT A PROJECT WITHOUT GETTING THEIR PANTIES ( SOORY LADIES) IN A WAD. JUST BECAUSE YOU TAKE A WIRING HARNESS OF ONE TRUCK AND PUT IT ON ANOTHER DOES NOT MAKE YOU A "DATSUN MECHANIC" THAT MEANS YOUR TO DAMN LAZY OR STUPID TO INCORPORATE YOUR OWN WIRE HARNESS INTO YOUR NEW TRUCK. THE PCM AND GLOW PLUG SYSTEM CAN BE HARD WIRED IN ALSO IVE DONE IT BEFORE NOT HARD. LIKE WAS POSTED HERE PREVIOUSLY, ITS COLOR CODED! GET A SCHEMATIC. 2 YOUR JUST A DUMBASS AND DONT KNOW SHIT ABOUT NISSAN DIESELS OR FOR THAT FACT ANY DIESELS. MAXIMAS CAME OUT WITH A LD28 DIESEL. SCOUTS CAME OUT WITH A SD33 INDUSTRIAL DIESEL. THE SD33 WAS OFFERED A TURBO THE LD28 WAS NOT IN THE USA. THE PUMPS ARE DIFFERENT YOU IDIOT.. THE LD28 HAS A PCM THE SD33 DOES NOT. NO JEEP, SCOUT, FORKLIFT,STATIONARY MOTOR OR SAILBOAT CAME WITH A PCM. IT IS AN INDUSTRIAL ENGINE HENCE "SD" SEVERE DUTY. "LD" LIGHT DUTY. THEY HAD TO PUT SD22 IN NISSAN TRUCKS BECAUSE OF THE WAY WE DRIVE OVER HERE. I GUESS A "DATSUN MECHANIC" WOULD KNOW THIS. 3 YOUR JUST A FUNNY A FUNNY GUY. YOU CALL YOUR SELF "DATSUN MECHANIC". ALL BS ASIDE IM SURE YOUR A GOOD GUY AND A DESCENT MECHANIC. YOU HAVE TO BE TO KEEP THIS SCRAP IRON RUNNING. ALL I WAS SAYING IS YOU DONT HAVE TO START FROM A POINT, GO 4 MILES DOWN THE ROAD TAKE A RIGHT GO 50 FEET, TURN RIGHT AGAIN GO 400 FEET AND THEN TURN LEFT. JUST TAKE A RIGHT AND GO 50 FEET. DONT MAKE IT HARDER THAN IT HAS TO BE..

 

 

He is correct that I don't know shit about 6 cylinder diesels, they are so long and won't fit in anything I work on, so I don't pay much attention to them other than knowing that the LD28 crank I beleave, is desired by the Z guys.

I mainly know about the SD22/25 series diesel engines, and that is what we are/were talking about here.

I don't call myself anything but "wayno", the label "datsun mechanic" was given to me by one of the mods on this forum.

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You are correct Wayno, the z guys like the crank. All a LD28 is was a gas \ diesel hybrid much like the old chevy 350 diesels of my day. The LD crank gives it more compression with its longer stroke. Will make a Z run like hell!! I like the dually. Most of the tons offered in our area were flatbeds. Neighbor has one i can pick up for 500 bucks. Might be a fun build.

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wondering if he ever got this truck drivable.  As for the galvanized tank...short term ok but long term storage not ok.

 

 

Galvanized tanks are not recommended for diesel fuel storage as the zinc reduces the storage life of diesel fuel by contributing to chemical instability. The short version means the fuel gets dark and yukkie quicker.

I saw a mention of using starting fluid to get the engine running. i hope he didn't use it. it can break rings. do not use starting fluid in diesels

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Guys i'm back. I want to give you an update. In short, my build was successfull. Please ask me a ton of questions so that i can reply with the anwer to keep the knowlege here. I can could not have done it with out you guys so this is my way of giving back.So the last time i posted i was in Lousiana. I am know in Corpus Christi, Texas. Yes, i drove the rig down. No problems. Very Proud! So to sum up my work, the objective was to take an 1982 diesel sd22 out of a datsun and install this engine , wire harness and all, into a 1985 king cab gasser. Once i puclled both engines out. I first thought that the motor mounts were the same. Lessons learned, they are slightly different which requried my to tack on new motor mount to accomodate the sd22. I then coupled the engine and trans and with the hood off and radiator out, i lowered the powertrain into the bay. The truck was about 2 foot off the ground and this is the only way it would have made it. once i, there are very little mechanical things to hookup. Maybe only the accelarator cable.

 

Now electrically, what i did was pull out the entire wire harness all the way from inside the dash to the engine bay. I reinstalled a complete diesel wiring harness. I have the electrical wiring schematics that are color coded. I could not have done it without this either. It is very usefull. I am willing to share. What i could have done differently that would have saved alot of time is install a second wiring harness. So instead of taking out the gas harness, i would leave it in and install the disesl harness in parallel. What you really need from the diesel harness is the glow plug relay and timer and fuel pump positioner. Those 3 things can be integrated rather thank pulling the entire harness out. However, i can say that i have a very neat looking engine bay. So once everything was installed i tried to crank and nothing. My battery was not good enough. so i towed her and push started her in 3rd. After ten yrs of bieng in a swamp, it is incredible that is started the way it did. It was very sound, it purred, and most suprising, it did not smoke.  I drove it to the nearest gas station and filled up the tank with fresh diesel. and the rest is history. i know have 6000 miles on it and is my daily driver. I have learned alots about the engine and have loads of extra parts that i am finally ready to sell. 

 

Please reply and lets get the details out for the knowledge of all.Looking forward to chatting .

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I have the same problem ,thanks for the answers because I almost bought one of those rod dropping gassers to drop my engine in but I guess I am looking for another diesel frame or whole truck unless somebody knows what truck it will fit otherwise because my frame is rusting holes and the box is a cobble rig anyway.

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Sounds like the only frame incompatibility was the motor mounts. Do you weld or have any connections to people who do?

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