Headgasket. Copper coat or No copper coat.

[Dat Lurka]

Just got my head back from the shop. Some people are saying to coppercoat both sides before installing. Some are saying it needs to be absolutely dry. The shop said only use coppercoat on metal headgaskets.

I want some more opinions.

It's a Victor Reinz felt/metal gasket.

 

The block doesn't have the greatest surface.

[datzenmike]

You can if you want, but you'll never get the head back off if it blows in the future. If the two surfaces are spotlessly clean and flat a regular head gasket will do. Nissan doesn't use sealers because they aren't needed. Threaded holes should be tapped to clean them out. Bolts are totally reusable but must be clean and undamaged, wipe threads with oily rag. Put a drop of motor oil under the head bolt washers. Torque in three stages and in the proper order. If you don't know just ask.

 

Clean the block surface and wire wheel it. Its cast iron and hard so this won't hurt it. Just wash the head.

[kelowg]

done head gasket 2 or 3 times and always use the pematex copper spray on sealer. never have had a problem with head gaskets, piston and rings is another story. thats the reason i have had head off

[Dat Lurka]

I have to rebuild it in the future.

 

Hand tight then 35-45-60lb?

 

 

 

 

Permatex is what I got. There the only ones still maing it that I could find.

Have you removed a head that was coppercoated?

[Sealik]

Never used them....always buy Felpro/Perma Torque

No slathering involved....zero HG failures

[datzenmike]

I have to rebuild it in the future.

 

Hand tight then 35-45-60lb?

 

 

 

R A D

7....8

3....4

1....2

5....6

9..10 in this sequence to 20 then 40 then 60.

 

Z24s are notorious for blowing the HGs at 100K so the factory recommends retorquing the bolts at every tune up. Loosen each bolt but only one at a time so that you can do them in any order you like. Loosen fully and immediately torque to 60 ft lbs. I see no harm in doing this to any L20B also.

[Skib]

some people choose to use it.

 

 

not needed tho

[Dat Lurka]

R A D

7....8

3....4

1....2

5....6

9..10 in this sequence to 20 then 40 then 60.

 

Z24s are notorious for blowing the HGs at 100K so the factory recommends retorquing the bolts at every tune up. Loosen each bolt but only one at a time so that you can do them in any order you like. Loosen fully and immediately torque to 60 ft lbs. I see no harm in doing this to any L20B also.

 

My pops said that when I get it done and drive it about 50 miles to take the valve cover off and make sure they're all at 60.

 

I'm leaning towards Copper Coating Mainly because of the condition of the block surface.

About to go to the shop and go at it with a wire wheel and shop vac.

[datzenmike]

Well if you have to, just do the block side. This way you will still be able to pry the head off if you ever need to at some future date. The cast iron block side is much harder and you can wire wheel it all you want to remove the old stuck on gasket. I would not want to try that on a soft aluminum head.

[Ratwagon1600]

Never used it.

 

Modern gaskets, certainly the ones we get here are all deigned to go on dry.

 

My two cents worth

[metalmonkey47]

I've used it and never had a problem with peeling it, but it wasn't on for more then a few months. Came off in one piece.

 

Old man recommended it and it worked good.

[Dirttrack510]

Contrary to belief Copper Coat will not make the head or head gasket hard to remove in the future, it's sort of like a spray on anti-seize that simply fills in imperfections in the block and head. I used it on my car and removed the head later with no problem. If your using the Felpro head gasket it already has a "sealant" made into it, if your using a cheaper or off brand I'd recommend it. You can use it on the Felpro if you want and it won't hurt anything, it'd just be extra "insurance" against leaks. Many old school hot rod guys still use it. It's not anything like silicone sealant and it doesn't harden up like that Indian Head stuff either. I actually use it on my intake/exhaust manifold gaskets now too, just as a precaution. Just spray a thin, but complete coat, wait a few minutes to let it cure a little, and then slap the gasket on and torque it down.

[Dat Lurka]

Contrary to belief Copper Coat will not make the head or head gasket hard to remove in the future, it's sort of like a spray on anti-seize that simply fills in imperfections in the block and head. I used it on my car and removed the head later with no problem. If your using the Felpro head gasket it already has a "sealant" made into it, if your using a cheaper or off brand I'd recommend it. You can use it on the Felpro if you want and it won't hurt anything, it'd just be extra "insurance" against leaks. Many old school hot rod guys still use it. It's not anything like silicone sealant and it doesn't harden up like that Indian Head stuff either. I actually use it on my intake/exhaust manifold gaskets now too, just as a precaution. Just spray a thin, but complete coat, wait a few minutes to let it cure a little, and then slap the gasket on and torque it down.

 

Nice reply, thanks!

My dad recommended it specifically because it fills any imperfections. My grandfather used it in Nascar.

Good thread here for future references.

[MikeRL411]

My 45 years experience says "yes, use it." Use margerine or cottage cheese cups in the bores while setting up for spraying the copper coat so that you don't have to choke on the first startup and you will be OK. And "Yes" to the ignoramouses, you need to remove the plastic cups before installing the head gasket and the head!

[TFM1066]

Heck ya, Copper coat is good stuff as stated above, plus it helps the transfer heat out of the head to the block. disassemble a snap if you ever have to take the head off later.

[Ranman72]

I use felpro or nissan gaskets and never use sealer except on water pump thermo housing and sometimes valve cover

[moparvwfreak]

i was curious about this and the head bolts as well. i'll pick some up at work when i order the last parts.

[Dat Lurka]

I gotta make some gaskets tomorrow.

Found two rolls of gasket material and a tube of blue in the shop :thumbup:

[banzai510(hainz)]

I do mine.

If you dont thats OK also

[Dat Lurka]

Headgasket is ON

With a nice layer of coppercoat.

The block ahd some bad pitting. Can't wait to fire it up.

[I'm BLUE]

How'd I miss this thread ?

 

I use it at my discretion. I like it !

I am just hobbyist though.

Never had a problem with it.

It's not like some permatex aviation sealant ( can't remember the # ... but the stuff is effing hell to get off ..... ) that glues everything on.

Actually Copper-Coat fairly easy to get off.

 

If your block surface is that bad ..

you might have to have it decked when rebuilt or not !?

IDK. Possibly a product made to get by.

Many L-series block surfaces are never perfect though.

 

Good job :D !

[Dat Lurka]

Couldn't have done it without Sasquatch and his sidekick!

 

When I can afford to do a rebuild the head will be dipped, bored, and surfaced.

[rfiercej]

"Contrary to belief Copper Coat will not make the head or head gasket hard to remove in the future, it's sort of like a spray on anti-seize that simply fills in imperfections in the block and head. I used it on my car and removed the head later with no problem. If your using the Felpro head gasket it already has a "sealant" made into it, if your using a cheaper or off brand I'd recommend it. You can use it on the Felpro if you want and it won't hurt anything, it'd just be extra "insurance" against leaks. Many old school hot rod guys still use it. It's not anything like silicone sealant and it doesn't harden up like that Indian Head stuff either. I actually use it on my intake/exhaust manifold gaskets now too, just as a precaution. Just spray a thin, but complete coat, wait a few minutes to let it cure a little, and then slap the gasket on and torque it down. "

 

Hands down....the best answer.  I have just over 300,000 miles on my 1992 Geo Metro that has gone from Texas to the East Coast, Minnesota, West Coast and beyond.  Geo Metros are notorious for burning exhaust valves due to a faulty EGR.  I have over 100,000 miles on the last overhaul including rings, rod bearings and a rebuilt head.  Copper Coat has been used on the initial rebuild at 125,000 miles and then again around 200,000 miles.   I have never had difficulty removing the head after using Copper Coat.  It is a great filler for imperfections as stated above and needs to be semi-tacky before placing the head on the block.  I use it on the head and the block and swear by the stuff.  

 

[ggzilla]

Yes it is good stuff. On the other hand, I've never had a problem not using it. Put hundreds of thousands of miles on many Datsuns and have never had a problem except when my radiator got a hole in it. Fixed that with Copper Seal.

[Cpl620]

I use it on metal head gaskets. never had a problem with it after the next rebuild.