blackdeth666 Posted April 3, 2012 Report Share Posted April 3, 2012 I picked up my 521 off of a friend of mine, he had put the motor/trans setup in it. Here's what it was: L20, Z car flywheel, and a dogleg 5speed. The dogleg got stuck in 3rd gear, then stolen from my driveway so it is out of the question. He gave me a 4speed, pretty sure it was the original one. I put it in, then the clutch wasn't engaging. I called him and he told me that when he took that 4speed out that there was a spacer (about 1/4" or so) between the crank and the flywheel that he removed. fuck. I got the spacer from him, pulled it all back apart and put it in. Now the clutch works again! BUT, I go to try and start the truck but the starter wont grab. I get a click like its trying, then every few tries a grind. I pulled the starter off and it appears that the starter gear isn't totally reaching the flywheel. I'm not sure what to now. Which part isn't adding up??? Quote Link to comment
datsunaholic Posted April 3, 2012 Report Share Posted April 3, 2012 The spacer is for an automatic. The reason the clutch isn't working withot the spacer is you need the throwout collar that matches the flywheel/clutch, not the transmission, So you need the Z-car throwout collar, that probably was still in the dogleg when it got stolen. Quote Link to comment
banzai510(hainz) Posted April 3, 2012 Report Share Posted April 3, 2012 Planning is everything!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Can the flywheel even go on with that spacer being on there????????? Quote Link to comment
bananahamuck Posted April 3, 2012 Report Share Posted April 3, 2012 There is a chart for throw out collar sizes around here some where .. Found a couple threads about it with pics............over look my stupid replies in those threads.. :hmm: http://community.ratsun.net/topic/38186-wtb-throwout-bearing-sleeve/page__fromsearch__1 http://community.ratsun.net/topic/37644-200mm-clutch-discs-and-release-bearing-assembly/page__fromsearch__1 Quote Link to comment
blackdeth666 Posted April 3, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 3, 2012 The spacer is for an automatic. The reason the clutch isn't working withot the spacer is you need the throwout collar that matches the flywheel/clutch, not the transmission, So you need the Z-car throwout collar, that probably was still in the dogleg when it got stolen. I'm almost positive I used the same throwout collar from the dogleg. When he gave me the 4speed there was nothing other than the shaft sticking out the front, so I had to use the existing parts from the dogleg. So there is no reason that the spacer should be on there with ANY manual transmission?? and I need to get a fatter throwout collar? Planning is everything!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Can the flywheel even go on with that spacer being on there????????? It went on easily, its basically just an extension off the back of the crank. The bolts had plenty to grab onto too. Quote Link to comment
datzenmike Posted April 3, 2012 Report Share Posted April 3, 2012 I picked up my 521 off of a friend of mine, he had put the motor/trans setup in it. Here's what it was: L20, Z car flywheel, and a dogleg 5speed. The dogleg got stuck in 3rd gear, then stolen from my driveway so it is out of the question. He gave me a 4speed, pretty sure it was the original one. I put it in, then the clutch wasn't engaging. I called him and he told me that when he took that 4speed out that there was a spacer (about 1/4" or so) between the crank and the flywheel that he removed. fuck. I got the spacer from him, pulled it all back apart and put it in. Now the clutch works again! BUT, I go to try and start the truck but the starter wont grab. I get a click like its trying, then every few tries a grind. I pulled the starter off and it appears that the starter gear isn't totally reaching the flywheel. I'm not sure what to now. Which part isn't adding up??? . The reason your starter isn't working is because you have a spacer between the crank and the flywheel. The spacer will move the flywheel (and the starter ring) away from the starter. That spacer has to come out of there. That flywheel is an unknown. If someone is wrong or mistaken then getting the correct bearing collar will be full of problems. The only way to be sure is to measure the friction surface diameter or the diameter of the clutch disc. It could be an L20B truck or a Z car wheel... both are 225mm. Measure and find out for sure. Measure across the shiny ring to confirm you have a 225mm flywheel.... If you don't have a metric tape it's 8 7/8" Only when you know for sure the exact size of your flywheel can you expect to order the correct collar size for your release bearing. Quote Link to comment
datsunaholic Posted April 4, 2012 Report Share Posted April 4, 2012 However, even flywheels with the same friction surface can have various different pressure plate thicknesses. I've heard that the 200mm from 68-73 isn't the same as the 77-81 200mm pressure plate, even though they're bolt-compatible. of course, if it's really a Z-car flywheel it'd be 225mm. But they can be either 200mm or 225mm on a L20B. The other issue is that the master cylinder might not have the same size engaging rod, or be truly mounted in the same place on different transmissions. Doglegs were not a car transmission, which means who knows what got put on there. Quote Link to comment
datzenmike Posted April 4, 2012 Report Share Posted April 4, 2012 Doglegs were not a car transmission, which means who knows what got put on there. I think you meant something else Doug. Quote Link to comment
datsunaholic Posted April 4, 2012 Report Share Posted April 4, 2012 Yes, I meant "not a truck transmission". Trying to type fast. Quote Link to comment
banzai510(hainz) Posted April 4, 2012 Report Share Posted April 4, 2012 Doug its the diaphrame height that was different on the 510 and the 200 sx ,flywheel is the same 200mm the 510 and the Roadster P/P have the same diaphrame height thus all other parts are 510 stuff can be used. 225mm you best look it up for diapharma height but the 240 Z P/P uses a different diahrame height as the the later Z cars. Its in the How to Modify book . has all the specs Quote Link to comment
Farmer Joe Posted April 4, 2012 Report Share Posted April 4, 2012 i just looked in the garage at my automatic trans stuff.. i know this 'spacer' your talking about.. this is for an auto config.. a manual flywheel doesnt need this spacer in any case ive ever heard.. when i swapped from the auto to the standard flywheel i took the spacer out.. its on the wall in the garage with the flexplate.. you need to find the right throwout collar for your transmission.. if you take the crank spacer off youll need a collar thats "a spacers length" longer... yanno what i mean? Quote Link to comment
blackdeth666 Posted April 4, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 4, 2012 . The reason your starter isn't working is because you have a spacer between the crank and the flywheel. The spacer will move the flywheel (and the starter ring) away from the starter. That spacer has to come out of there. That flywheel is an unknown. If someone is wrong or mistaken then getting the correct bearing collar will be full of problems. The only way to be sure is to measure the friction surface diameter or the diameter of the clutch disc. It could be an L20B truck or a Z car wheel... both are 225mm. Measure and find out for sure. Measure across the shiny ring to confirm you have a 225mm flywheel.... If you don't have a metric tape it's 8 7/8" Only when you know for sure the exact size of your flywheel can you expect to order the correct collar size for your release bearing. i just looked in the garage at my automatic trans stuff.. i know this 'spacer' your talking about.. this is for an auto config.. a manual flywheel doesnt need this spacer in any case ive ever heard.. when i swapped from the auto to the standard flywheel i took the spacer out.. its on the wall in the garage with the flexplate.. you need to find the right throwout collar for your transmission.. if you take the crank spacer off youll need a collar thats "a spacers length" longer... yanno what i mean? I had a feeling that the trans was having to come back out. At least its not a cast iron powerglide! I know for sure that it is a Z flywheel, which one specifically I don't know. This makes sense now, what I really needed was a collar that was about 1/4" longer, not that spacer. Lesson learned the hard way. again. So when I do pull it apart, am I able to order one of these in various sizes or is it going to be a hunt? There is a chart for throw out collar sizes around here some where .. Found a couple threads about it with pics............over look my stupid replies in those threads.. :hmm: http://community.rat...__fromsearch__1 http://community.rat...__fromsearch__1 thanks for the links, much help in understanding! Quote Link to comment
datzenmike Posted April 4, 2012 Report Share Posted April 4, 2012 If you are sure about it being a 225mm wheel you now need to know exactly which pressure plate you have on it. There are probably dozens of 225mm pressure plates divided into 3 or more different diaphragm finger heights. If for sure you are positive that you installed a 280z or zx non turbo pressure plate on that wheel then the pressure plate number is 30210-N4210 has an installed finger height of 33-35mm and the correct collar should be 30501-N1600. (this collar is even used on the 2004 Exterra). My part numbers should be correct for the info given, but you had better verify. If this is a 240z or 260z pressure plate then the above info does not apply. Quote Link to comment
blackdeth666 Posted April 10, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 10, 2012 Well I got it all fixed! I probably would have sold this truck long ago without the support of RATSUN! so thanks for everyones help. My friend who I bought the truck from had a few bearing collars in his parts stash, so I dropped my trans and sure enough the on he gave me was longer. I pulled out that flywheel spacer, installed a new throwout bearing then put it all back together and voila! starter works, clutch works, everyone's happy! and did I mention how easy it was dropping the trans without the torsion bars in the way? :thumbup: heres that spacer I pulled out. Quote Link to comment
banzai510(hainz) Posted April 11, 2012 Report Share Posted April 11, 2012 left looks like a L20 set up. at least the bearing looks like a 225mm type. the right looks like a 200mm 510/521 set up Quote Link to comment
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