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FRAM vs. NAPA (Wix) comparison


HRH

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A 1551 is a hydraulic oil filter (we use them as fuel filters on our race boats). The Napa & Wix oil filters I use are some variant of 1515, usually 21515 but "1515" is the WIX generic number for a Motorcraft FL1A type filter. And I've never paid more than $7 for one, Carquest, NAPA, National, etc.

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Because for some reason there is a separate listing for the "correct" filter. I don't know why. Probably started when Datsuns were introduced as a way to market something or differentiate, and they may have been different at one time. I've drilled it into the entire district in Spokane though that 1515 fits almost all L or Z series Datsun motors. I used to not know either.

 

I've also had a guy with a Ford tractor looking for the correct 1452 filter for it. He got downright pissed off that I tried to sell him the 1515 even though I explained it was the same filter and half the cost. Fing moron wouldn't have it and walked out.

 

However, your local NAPA should know that. If they don't, inform them. That's about all I can do on my end! ;)

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In 2005 my neighbor's engine lost oil pressure and hammered the #1 rod bearing, damaged the crankshaft. Too bad I didn't take note of the brand of oil filter or cut it apart. We found a rubber flat round thing wadded up in the block oil feed hole. It might have the interior filter gasket like in your photos.

 

Note that the Pennzoil filter in the photo is not the one that was on it when the damage occured.

20051015152640DSC00338.jpg

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WOW! Holy hell Frams are cheaper then shit.

 

Kinda wanted to do this for a long time.

 

 

 

HRH, what does a NapaGold filter run for the L20B? I'm sure you know this off the top of your head laugh.gif

 

P/N for the highest capacity filter would be nice too tongue.gif

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In 2005 my neighbor's engine lost oil pressure and hammered the #1 rod bearing, damaged the crankshaft. Too bad I didn't take note of the brand of oil filter or cut it apart. We found a rubber flat round thing wadded up in the block oil feed hole. It might have the interior filter gasket like in your photos.

 

Note that the Pennzoil filter in the photo is not the one that was on it when the damage occured.

20051015152640DSC00338.jpg

 

 

Wouldn't be surprised. You know how you have that one roommate where you ask when the last time they changed the oil was and they respond with, I think it was last year? Yep, that'll do it!

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Guest kamakazi620

Moral of todays story Don't use Japanese parts on your Japanese vehicle!!!!!! :lol: what ive learned is all the filters crush EASY in the jiffy lube crusher EXCEPT the Union Sangyo filter it was hard as fuck to crush........

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Guest kamakazi620

Why do you think the Japanese filter is better than the WIX? Have you cut one open?

What makes You think Japanese cars are Better than Domestic?????

cutaway_oilfilter.gif

unionsangyo.jpg

All i'm sayin' is I like Made in Japan on my parts that go in my made in Japan vehicle

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Also, the matter of the 1452 being shorter Micro, I just checked: It isn't. 5.178" tall. They're listed the same height online. It's exactly the same part, but those who don't know pay extra. Same micron rating, same gasket, same thread, same size. Maybe at one time they were a different height. Don't know. And the 1452 is $11.25 online.

 

I don't remember saying anything about a 1452... I said 1521. Easy to remember, because the last 3 numbers in it are "521". No such thing as a Datsun "452", so you can go ahead and forget about that filter.

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Yeah the Fram really doesn't look too bad these days. I mean how many pleats do you need? And coil spring vs. sheet spring, big deal.

 

But more important is the sealing, where NAPA Gold seems to have an advantage. What is the "separate chamber" than HRH was talking about? Datsun engine have a blockage valve built into the oil pump, so would the one in the oil filter ever be used?

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I don't remember saying anything about a 1452... I said 1521. Easy to remember, because the last 3 numbers in it are "521". No such thing as a Datsun "452", so you can go ahead and forget about that filter.

 

 

I stand corrected! Now I remember too, the 1521 is the short version indeed, fits roadsters too if I remember correctly. When you look up a filter at work for a Datsun L20 it will show a 1452 in the computer, which is indeed the same as a 1515. The 1521 is 3.79" tall, which is one hell of a lot shorter for those applications where needed.

 

The separate bypass chamber is what I was talking about. The silver thing after the drainback valve on the Gold. In the event the filter gets totally clogged and can't pass any more oil, it starts bypassing but does it through that litle silver spring loaded disc. Oil completely stops entering the filter, which is good because if it's actually that full, there's a good chance the filter media could start to disintegrate and go through the oil gallery. That separate bypass valve prevents that.

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I still like OEM filters for my engines. My logic is this.

Lets say car car companies try to scrimp on the quality of the filter. I am not saying they do, but lets just suggest some accountant in the car company thinks that saving a few pennies on engine oil filters is a good idea.

Most new cars go to the dealer for engine oil changes, at least for a while. If sometime in the warranty period, an engine gets scrapped, because of an oil filter failure, and the car owner comes back with "but all my oil changes were done at your dealership", the car company is out a lot of money for the engine replacement. Their reputation is also marred.

How many sales do you think Toyota lost because of an issue with floor mats causing the gas pedal to stick down?

So car companies have a good reason to maintain their oil filters quality at a high level. The filter costs a little more to make, but they save in the long run by avoiding oil filter caused engine failures.

 

Lets talk about a generic company that makes oil filters. These filters are generally sold to people doing their own oil changes. These filters are generally used on older engines. They have no control of what oil was used in the engine. There are many other factors an engine failure could be blamed on besides the oil filter, even if the oil filter was the root cause of the problem. Additionally, the filter sales is how the generic company is making a profit. It makes economic sense to make the quality of the filter to as close to acceptable as possible. Then you factor in promotional costs. You are paying for the filter, the parts and labor in it, and you are paying the production costs of that Saturday morning TV show that advertises the filter as the one to use.

You do not have promotional costs built in an OEM filter. In short, A car company has lower promotional costs for it's oil filters, a greater stake in having a good quality oil filter. Also car companies have literally spent millions of dollars studying oil filters.

 

That has covered OEM filters, and the low end of oil filters. In the middle, are companies who sell to the general public, but their main business is selling oil filters and other car parts to non dealer professional mechanics. If they had some bad oil filters, the word would spread, and their business would go away. To be clear, I consider NAPA, and WIX oil filters in this category.

 

So for me, I currently have two brands of engines I deal with, Datsun, and Ford. The Fords are easy. My boat engine, the vehicle that tows it, and my two older Ford pickups use the Motorcraft FL1-A oil filter. So do some other boats I work on, with remote oil filters. I can get then at Wal*Mart for less than $4.00 each. This is a good oil filter. Several independent sources have confirmed my belief in that. The price is less that almost all the prices I have seen mentioned in this thread, even for the orange oil filters.

 

My Datsun L-16. and L-18 engines have an oil filter bypass built in the the engine block. It is visible when you take the oil filter off the engine. The OEM oil filter from Nissan, does not have a bypass in it. The filter does not need it. This is the reason I choose to use a Nissan oil filter for my Datsun engines.

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I still like OEM filters for my engines. My logic is this.

Lets say car car companies try to scrimp on the quality of the filter. I am not saying they do, but lets just suggest some accountant in the car company thinks that saving a few pennies on engine oil filters is a good idea.

Most new cars go to the dealer for engine oil changes, at least for a while. If sometime in the warranty period, an engine gets scrapped, because of an oil filter failure, and the car owner comes back with "but all my oil changes were done at your dealership", the car company is out a lot of money for the engine replacement. Their reputation is also marred.

How many sales do you think Toyota lost because of an issue with floor mats causing the gas pedal to stick down?

So car companies have a good reason to maintain their oil filters quality at a high level. The filter costs a little more to make, but they save in the long run by avoiding oil filter caused engine failures.

 

Lets talk about a generic company that makes oil filters. These filters are generally sold to people doing their own oil changes. These filters are generally used on older engines. They have no control of what oil was used in the engine. There are many other factors an engine failure could be blamed on besides the oil filter, even if the oil filter was the root cause of the problem. Additionally, the filter sales is how the generic company is making a profit. It makes economic sense to make the quality of the filter to as close to acceptable as possible. Then you factor in promotional costs. You are paying for the filter, the parts and labor in it, and you are paying the production costs of that Saturday morning TV show that advertises the filter as the one to use.

You do not have promotional costs built in an OEM filter. In short, A car company has lower promotional costs for it's oil filters, a greater stake in having a good quality oil filter. Also car companies have literally spent millions of dollars studying oil filters.

 

That has covered OEM filters, and the low end of oil filters. In the middle, are companies who sell to the general public, but their main business is selling oil filters and other car parts to non dealer professional mechanics. If they had some bad oil filters, the word would spread, and their business would go away. To be clear, I consider NAPA, and WIX oil filters in this category.

 

So for me, I currently have two brands of engines I deal with, Datsun, and Ford. The Fords are easy. My boat engine, the vehicle that tows it, and my two older Ford pickups use the Motorcraft FL1-A oil filter. So do some other boats I work on, with remote oil filters. I can get then at Wal*Mart for less than $4.00 each. This is a good oil filter. Several independent sources have confirmed my belief in that. The price is less that almost all the prices I have seen mentioned in this thread, even for the orange oil filters.

 

My Datsun L-16. and L-18 engines have an oil filter bypass built in the the engine block. It is visible when you take the oil filter off the engine. The OEM oil filter from Nissan, does not have a bypass in it. The filter does not need it. This is the reason I choose to use a Nissan oil filter for my Datsun engines.

Your logic is flawed.No car company makes filters.Some big name company is making them for them.And as far as the "But i had my oil changes done at your dealer"rant goes,it's a moot point because it doesn't matter.Per the law,car companies can NOT void a warrantee just because after market parts were used.

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OK, so there is not some guy back in some corners of the Nissan factory making oil filters. But I will guarantee you they have specifications on what they want in a oil filter, and if their supplier of oil filters is not up to the quality they want, they do make changes to get the quality they want, even if it means going to another vendor.

 

I can remember when Firestone used to supply tires to Ford, almost exclusively. After issues with Firestone tires, not any more.

 

I still think the best oil filter for an engine is the oil filter made with specifications from the company that made the engine. Not an oil filter made to fit many applications as possible to reduce the number of oil filters you have to carry.

 

If the NAPA 1515 oil filter will work on my Ford, it has an internal bypass valve. My Datsun does not need this valve, the factory put one in the block. Will the 1515 filter screw on, and will the gasket on it match the sealing surface, yes. That alone does not mean it is the correct oil filter for my Datsun.

 

As for Ford filters on my Ford, I am getting a quality, made in the USA OEM filter for less that 4 bucks.

 

These are logical, not emotional reasons for my oil filter choice.

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OK, so there is not some guy back in some corners of the Nissan factory making oil filters. But I will guarantee you they have specifications on what they want in a oil filter, and if their supplier of oil filters is not up to the quality they want, they do make changes to get the quality they want, even if it means going to another vendor.

 

I can remember when Firestone used to supply tires to Ford, almost exclusively. After issues with Firestone tires, not any more.

 

I still think the best oil filter for an engine is the oil filter made with specifications from the company that made the engine. Not an oil filter made to fit many applications as possible to reduce the number of oil filters you have to carry.

 

If the NAPA 1515 oil filter will work on my Ford, it has an internal bypass valve. My Datsun does not need this valve, the factory put one in the block. Will the 1515 filter screw on, and will the gasket on it match the sealing surface, yes. That alone does not mean it is the correct oil filter for my Datsun.

 

As for Ford filters on my Ford, I am getting a quality, made in the USA OEM filter for less that 4 bucks.

 

These are logical, not emotional reasons for my oil filter choice.

If you want to pay two to three times the amount of money for a factory filter that is being made a compnay that makes other filters to the same specs,then go ahead.It makes ZERO sense,but it's your money.ANd if you are referring to the Ford Explorer problem,the issue was NOT FIRESTONE tires.THe valve issue is also moot.The logic of this post is even less than the last one.

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The last time I bought Nissan filters, they were $8.47 each. And again, it is the correct filter, without an oil bypass valve. That price is a little high, but not out of line.

 

For the Ford, I have said several times the OEM Motorcraft oil filters are at Wal*Mart, for less than $4.00.

 

If I run out of these options, I probably would use NAPA, or WIX. They are good oil filters.

 

If you work for NAPA, I can understand your passion, but I have tried to explain why I made my decision.

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