Where does one stop?

[boxboy]

Okay gentlemen, I need some advice. My 520 seems to run just fine. No strange noises, no problems. However, it leaks fluid everywhere. Front seal is bad, oil filter housing, tappet covers and who knows where else. I almost suspect a freeze plug seeping, but it would be on the back of the head facing the fire wall and I can't see it. It blows white smoke on start up, (much more now that its cold), but once its warmed up, almost no noticeable/visible exhaust. The clutch will need to be replaced before too long, and I have the kit already. I have a gasket kit as well for the entire engine, plus a NOS copper head gasket.

 

My thinking thus far was to do the top end stuff while the clutch is hanging on. But do I just do the easy ones, or go all the way to the head gasket and work out? I don't want to get the easy gaskets done and then wish I had done the head gasket and have to buy a whole new gasket kit. If I do that, then I feel like it would be a waste to have the head off and not remove the carbon, possibly have the valve seals replaced, head checked for true etc. Or is it okay to just do the gaskets and leave everything else alone. If it ain't broke don't fix it? I just don't know. I don't think the engine needs a rebuild as it has been a DD for the last several years and seems to run fine. Although when I bought it the coolant level was quite low which makes me wonder about the head gasket. I am stuck, and so I end up not doing anything which is frustrating to me.

 

Help me get moving guys.

[Wide14u]

i think i would do it all

[datzenmike]

Find the time and yank the motor to change the clutch. While the motor is out change everything that is now easy to get at. You can remove the carbon from the combustion chambers if you want but you don't have to make it spotless as it just comes back anyway. In cold weather it's normal for white condensation to come out the tailpipe. I would only suspect a bad head gasket if there were unexplained coolant loss from the rad. If removing the pan to replace a leaking gasket why not replace the rod and main bearings? The crank does not have to come out for this. The top bearing halves can be put on and rotated into place. New mains and rods will reduce oil consumption, raise oil pressure and strengthen the bottom end. But only if they are old and you can afford it.

 

You can elect to remove the head and /or do a valve job/valve seals when the motor is back in if you want.

 

Remove the motor with both manifolds attached, easier this way.

[wayno]

Is this the one with the leaking rear seal?

[boxboy]

Then I ask myself, why not have the engine rebuilt if I am going that far? I am not qualified to do a rebuild, and I don't even know if I would attempt bearings. Wouldn't I have to know what size bearings to get? Or just get standards and assume they will fit? I don't know the history of this engine, if it has ever been rebuilt, or even the mileage. Truck OD says 25K. Who knows how many times it has rolled? J13 parts aren't easy to come by. I don't think bearings would cost much for the parts. Just the guy with the know how to do it for me. I would like to get that rear main seal done though.

 

Wayno, I don't know that it is leaking. Just assuming since everything else is!

[wayno]

If the rear seal is leaking then the engine needs to be worked on, it might not need rebuilt, but it doesn't do any good to replace the clutch if it is leaking. I have tore down engines and put them back together without rebuilding them, I just put every part back exactly how i pulled it out after I replaced the rear rope seal, and it ran great. But I knew the engine was good except for the leaky seal. I also had a book to get the info I needed for the torque specs. and what order to torque it. I have a book that gives the correct torque values for the rods and mains and head for the J block and torque order for the head, you can purchase this book, I just don't remember where anymore. It is "chiltons, datsun 1961-72", part # 5790. I rebuilt my roadster engine and transmission with this book. But this book doesn't tell you how to replace the rear main seal, I have already been down that road. You need to decide when to tear it down if the rear seal is leaking and understand that suprizes do occur that would mean more work/money/time than you thought, it seems to take me all day to put together an engine because I take my time and check everything five times, i'll help you if i can, but this is just a fun hobby to me, and I make mistakes all the time, mike says it the best, I quote him, "You don't have to be bright to be me, sadly, I prove this nearly everyday!!!" wayno

[wayno]

Hey there Boxboy, there is a "datsun motor and tranny" for sale in the corvallis/albany craigslist that is suppose to run good, I suspect it is a J 1300 out of a 67 pickup. This would be a good way to rebuild your engine at your pace yet still have a drivable truck, or just replace your engine if it does run good. wayno

[boxboy]

Perhaps some compression testing is in order. I agree with you Wayno that if you are going to do it, do it right. I just am realizing that I don't really have the confidence to pull it off. Like I said, the truck really seems to run great. Just so many darn leaks. I have never done any rebuilding. Not even dreaming of doing it in a day as you suggest you can do going slow. And all I have for the manual is the FSM. It doesn't really give much detail.

 

I know you guys are right. Just need a buddy with mechanical skills to help me walk through it. Or, someone who wants to rebuild it for me. Know anyone in the Canby area?

[wayno]

I guess everything depends on where you want to end up, you want to get another hundred thousand miles, rebuild it. I don't go that route very often, normally I find a good running one and swap them out, thats what I did with the 521 work truck engine(L20b), except I had some expencive head work done and bought new SU carbs from nissan when they had a sale(lucky, $200.00 each), and have beat the shit(not my description) out of the truck for over 10 years now, I wanted power, the L16 that was in it had none, it was a piece of :poop:.

[boxboy]

Just for an idea I called Portland Engine Rebuilders today to see what they might charge to rebuild a J13. WOW!! He said he couldn't give me a real quote without doing some research into parts availability, but that ball park I would be looking at around $1800! Yikes. We won't be going that route. What he did suggest was that I get a leak down test done at a local shop and see if it was worth regasketing. No reason to do it if everything is just going to blow out on my again. Seems like a good idea. I may have to look into that as a first step.

[sycloned916]

Wow $1800 for a rebuild they better use some Good parts in it for that price. You can do the rebuild yourself,have all the machine work done and assembly it. Gaskets shouldn't be too bad if you pull the motor if you do your clutch. Just depends on how far you want to go, the L-motor is a hassle my buddy has a L20 in his 520 and seems like there's no room for a radiator plus you need to weld in some 521 frame mounts. I would do it myself,I did my first 520's J13 head gasket and some other gaskets with no problems and I drove the hell out of it. Good Luck man!

[wayno]

That datsun engine and tranny thats in the corvallis/albany craigslist is still there, it was pulled to do an engine swap(upgrade), that is the way I would go if I was going to stick with the J13, put that engine in your truck and then slowly buy what is needed to rebuild your block if that's the way you want to go. wayno

[burrito213]

trust me, i am in the same boat....

 

there is a complete engine rebuild kit on ebay, timing stuff, water pumps, dizzys, etc..all for the j13 and j15....

 

i want to do buy the parts and have an engine shop strip my engine and put it back together but they dont call me back and DatsunPartsLLC in rancho cucamonga ca wont even touch my engine and offered to sell a "L" engine and tranny even after i told him i drive a 320.

 

i bought a complete gasket set for 85 on ebay.

[mklotz70]

Every opinion is going to be different since everyone has different skills, confidence levels and abilities......and let's not forget money. Guys with money can dive head first since they can always buy their way out. Guys with experience and dive in, knowing they can do it. I always try to have an exit strategy anytime I'm trying something new and don't have the skills or the money. :) It's a good running motor.....don't fix what isn't broken or you'll have something broken....Murphy's law!! I'd get a bottle of Bearin' Seal by Gunk/Solder Seal and run that in it for a week or two. It will re-swell the seals and may just stop the vast majority of your leaks. $4 first option. I've used it on at least a half dozen motors....I hate tearing motors apart to fix leaks and that little bottle has spared me a lot of grief.

 

I would have the gaskets on hand, but I would NOT pull the head!!! Unless you have a bad compression test! If you do, get a different motor like Wayne said. On my NL...I changed all the easy ones....I did not change the rear main or the head gasket......there's no way in the world I'm going to pull the crank on a motor that runs good when all I want is for the dang pan gasket to stop oozing! LOL!! Sorry Mike....I'm a huge fan of yours and you are most certainly right about everything you've said....but I'm much more of a engine newb and can relate to the fear of just thinking about doing some of that stuff! :) Anyway.....

 

 

Is the clutch bad? The motor is easy enough to pull...I'd leave the mani's on as suggested until you get it out. Put it on an eng stand, clean it up, regasket the easy stuff :) ......this is of course, only if the clutch is bad and/or the Bearin' Seal doesn't work!!

 

If it's only a few drips over night....I'd lay my money on the yellow bottle.....and if it's only a drip or two a night....I'd park over a pan and just keep driving it!! :)

[boxboy]

Ah Mklotz, now you are speakin' my language! I do think I should do a leak down test or at least a compression test. But barring any really bad news I am thinking perhaps just a Seafoam treatment, drain the oil and do the top end gaskets in the truck. My clutch seams to have a little bit of an intermittent issue, which makes me think it is unevenly worn springs, or a sketchy bearing or something. But I am willing to live with it a while longer. I can do it when it becomes less intermittent. I don't know that Mike's conn. rod replacement is not a bad idea if I can just swap them out. All in all, I am with you MKlotz. Keep it simple. Blowby can't be too bad if I am not burning a lot of oil. I don't have any smoke coming out the tail pipe, so I think I am good.

 

Thanks for looking out fur us poor inexperienced guys Mklotz!

[mklotz70]

Your clutch could be a throwout bearing that's hanging up, or possibly, I slave cylinder that's hanging up.

 

You're more than welcome. Mike knows waaaaaay more about rebuilds than I do....I simply tear them apart so they're not so heavy for the scrap guy :) Funny....with my projects, I get way too involved and over my head, but I've got pretty good perspective when it comes to other people's projects :)

[datzenmike]

Absolutely Mike. I wasn't thinking in terms of someone else looking at it. Yes being over or falsely confident can lead to disaster. Much depends on your own comfort/experience level too. $6 fix is well worth the try. I remember having a power steering leak and used something like that... damn! it actually worked!!!

[boxboy]

Funny how it is easier to show restraint when it isn't your project isn't it? I usually get in over my head pretty quick because I really WANT to have all the skills and bills to get a good resto done. Thanks for giving me a better perspective Mklotz. The best way for me to go about this project is probably backwards from most projects. The thing seems to run and stop great. I have all the stuff to get the front end back in shape (Wheel bearings on the way, Kingpins in the parts box. Probably could use some rubber bushings here and there). Then I can do the paint and body work on everything but the engine bay. When the clutch craps out, I can yank the motor and do all that stuff. Who knows, it may last a good long while. It is a Datsun! I have no overheating issues, no blue smoke. It may not be perfect, but life is about the process, right?

[mklotz70]

Yep...life is about the journey, not the destination. :)

 

For me, I start thinking I'll do one or two little things, then I figure, while I'm at it, I'll do this and that....next thing you know, I've got a huge list. That's when I get overwhelmed and don't do anything! I have to remind myself that I can pull the motor, fix the clutch and put it back together....I don't have to do a complete rebuild and engine bay painting at the same time. It's okay to pull the motor again later when the time and money are right to do that. Of course, if you've seen my "Mend" project, you know that this is a lot easier for me to say than do!!! LOL! :)

 

Speaking of Mend.....I should get busy :)

[wayno]

Hi Mike, I got to say that I am glad that your desire overwelmed you judgement on the NL engine bay,:unsure: as that is one less thing I have to do on it, it's so pretty.:D I do know what your talking about though, it is best to have a max of one project going on at a time, but I am unable to follow that line of thinking,:( Speaking of projects..... :lol: :lol: :lol:

[mklotz70]

...oh...I didn't say I only do one project at a time......I just get deep into a project mentally, before I even start, that I get overwhelmed and don't even start. I've got 4 or 5 projects going right now.

 

.....back to boxboy :)

[boxboy]

Boxboy has lots of projects going on at once too. But I make very slow progress on all of them! Getting the wife through school is a big one right now, so that is why I like Mike's line of thinking with the little yellow bottle. But I also like things done right so I don't have to do them again. Took the 520 into town today. Ran like a champ. Cold blooded though. I am running 20w 50, so when it is 32 degrees out the thing doesn't like it much.

 

Mike, I just looked at the "mend" thread. I inspected my firewall recently and realized that someone did a piss poor fix on my gas pedal support. Just tack welded on the bracket. That's one thing I will have to address when I get the engine out. There is a riveted patch by the battery box too. But i think that is pretty much it for the welding. But like I said all this is going to take me some time. I consider all these questions and conversations I have on here as the prerequisite education before I jump in. I appreciate all the info you and others provide on this site.

[mklotz70]

I need to revisit the gas pedal repair and see if I can smooth out the welds a bit :) There's 158 days left until Canby....at 2 hr/day, + 10hr on each weekend X's approx 22 weeks left....that's about 440 hours of work time available. That's fairly conservative. Could easily be more, but life usually makes it less.....we'll see :)

[elmerfudpucker]

There is another option, Skib and Kami are nearish to you and they may be bribed with food and beer.... ;)

[boxboy]

I just wanted to follow up with this thread. So far I have: replaced the oil filter housing gasket, both tappet gaskets, replaced the front timing cover with one that has a neoprene seal that I got from a fellow Ratsuner, new exhaust gasket, new fuel pump gaskets and spacer (and filed the aluminum casting flat again which now makes it seal properly), flushed the radiator cleaned it and painted it, painted the valve cover adjusted the valves, and installed a new oil pressure gauge. I also wire wheeled my rusty grill and painted it with some silver paint. It ain't chrome, but it ain't rust either. I should take some pics, I know. I also had to replace the wheel bearings on one side as I was getting grease melting out the dust cap.

 

Anyway, the good news is that I put a clean piece of cardboard underneath her after my 5 mile test drive and the next morning, not one drip!!:D I am sure it won't last, but I am happy for now. I'll get pics up sooner or later.