Front/bell housing swap. Front cover won't come off.

[dimedriver]

I have a KA 5 speed that I'm going to try and do this with.

http://zhome.com/ZCMnL/tech/240SX5spd/transmission.htm

 

I have a Z 4 speed and a the KA transmission. I have tried to remove the font covers of both of them but they just will not budge.

 

What is the trick?

 

I have left the pivot bolt on and hit it a few times with a hammer but it still does not move.

 

I sprayed them both with tons of PB blaster and will try again tomorrow.

 

And where do a get honda bond or yamabond? Im guessing a motorcycle shop but un-sure. I have some VW oil pan sealer would that work? Its pretty mean stuff.

 

-Dime

[datzenmike]

This is my CA 5 spd but yours is similar. There are 5 12mm bolts to remove. Whatever you do.... doNOT hammer on the long nose that sticks out around the input shaft. It it thin and will break off. Try tapping on the steel clutch arm pivot.

 

 

 

 

 

 

.

[dimedriver]

I removed the 5 bolts before hammering on the clutch fork pivot. I have also restrained myself from hammering on the sleeve around the input shaft. Its almost as if the thing was glued on.

 

 

-Dime

[Dime Dave]

If the forward case is stuck to the center plate you may need to force them apart. The dowels will sometime get stuck. I have had to actually take a gasket scrapper (HD Craftsman type) and drive it in between the case and center plate to get things freed up. Remember to take all the bolts out at the center plate and to take off the front cover inside the bell housing. There is also an external snap ring on the input shaft bearing that needs to be removed before the forward case can be removed. In the first photo you can see the snap ring with the gap at about 1:00.

(Photos by Chris Saulnier)

 

 

Here is a photo of the whole gear assembly, note the groove on the input shaft bearing.

 

[Dime Dave]

Well let me back up.

 

If it is the front cover that is stuck (my mis-read), once the 5 bolts are removed, it should come off with little effort. If you can use a rocker bar and get under the edge of the cover it will take very little pressure to get the cover to loosen up. I've never had one stick to the point it became bothersome to remove, that is why I jumped right to the front case removal.

 

Now those I have had to apply some extra effort to.

[dimedriver]

On the transmission I'm getting the bell/front housing from, I have already gotten the front section to crack away from the center section. I sprayed the front cover good with PB blaster last night. I hope a good socking is all it needs. Does anyone know what the industrial numbers for the bearings are? I have found this great bearing supply house http://www.VXB.com I think the rear wheel bearings are numbers 6206 inner and 6306 outer. They have them for under $10 each. I would double check the sizes before ording but that beats Autozone's and Rockauto's prices pretty easily.

I hope they have the bearings used in the transmission also.

 

-Avery

[datzenmike]

Don't go cheap on these. The 56mm counter bearing is known for failing, beginning with a growling sound.

 

Here's what happens when you ignore your tranny. See the counter shaft at the bottom? See the inner bearing race on the front, where's the rest of the bearing? I was hoping to use this 5spd so I drained it and the oil looked like silver spray paint only thicker. A couple of ball bearings fell out with the oil so I took it apart. The counter shaft snapped off right at the adapter plate!!! It should go right through and also hold the reverse and over drive counter gears.

 

 

With the front bearing gone the counter shaft would be forced away from the top main shaft under load causing it to flex just forward of the adapter plate till if fractured. Could have been saved.

 

Use quality bearings, (not knock-offs from China) Use ONLY GL-4 gear or or synthetic, never tow in 5th gear. 5th gear is for steady, level, highway cruise only, always down shift for passing and climbing grades. 4th gear transmits power directly through the main shaft and avoids excessive side loading of the counter shaft front bearing that will occur if 5th is used for this.

 

Change the oil every 25,000 miles or 40,000 Km and you should be problem free. Now who out there has changed their tranny oil every 25 to 30 thousand miles? Raise your hands..... no-one? I rest my case.

[dimedriver]

Thanks I will make sure to get good bearings for this. I plan on doing some track days with this transmission so its important that its reliable. Im heading home from work now. I will have an update on the front cover removal in about an hour.

 

 

-Dime

[datzenmike]

The FS5W71C that you are swapping the front case onto has a larger (stronger) 62mm bearing on the front of the counter shaft which is an improvement. If you can get the case modified so you can keep it. Run the 'C' cover plate as it also has internal galleries for much improved oil circulation. And don't forget to drill out the holes, on in the top of the case at about 2 o'clock at the J shaped casting and a larger one just to the left of both bearing holes in the picture below.

 

 

If you opt for keeping the 56mm 'B' bearing it still couldn't hurt to modify the case for better oiling. But use the 'C' front cover plate. Something to think about.

 

Here's my front cover showing the slots for oil flow.

 

 

.

[72240z]

The write ups actually call for the case to be modified to accept the front 62mm cs bearing.

Would be kind of counter productive to switch for a stronger tranny then not use the stronger bearing lol.

 

I have a FS5W71C sitting waiting to do this myself. Just want to get up and running before I move into custom stuff.

[Guest DatsuNoob]

Question Mike, I already did the 62mm swap using the NAP-Z bell that it came with. Arent the oiling holes already sufficient in size since that's how they rolled outta the factory? I've already got my motor and everything already put together and dont really wanna rip it all apart again, oh and about the Hondabond, I bought mine off ebay, it was pretty cheap.

[dimedriver]

Thanks guys,

Hammering didn't help to much. I fount that I could put a flat head screw driver in threw the clutch fork hole and pry up on the cover. It came more or less right off. Those gaskets are tuff.

 

 

 

 

The transmission doesn't look bad all the bearing turn easy.

 

I will drop the bell and tail housing off at the machine shop today for a cleaning. I will then machine the bell housing myself. I will make sure to copy all oiling features found in the newer ball housing.

 

 

If you want to look at all the pictures check out http://picasaweb.google.com/anisbet/510Transmission

 

-Dime