The J18 - J16 engines (J1800 J1600)

[fisch]

Thought I'd start a thread about the mexican J-18 and JDM J-16.

 

The J18s were used in Mexico in the Datsun Sakura (180SX Silvia) right up into the 80's. They are essentially the same as the other J-series and E1 and C, which were based on the BMC b-series engine. But they are 1790cc and came with 5-speeds.

 

A couple differences are that the motor mounts mount in a different (middle) location than the other J, E1 and C engines. But if you look at the picture, you can see the front mounting plate, and that is where the non J18 engines mounted. I would almost suspect you could put mounts in that older style location.

 

The other thing I read is that they require the J-18 oil pump, and can't use the others for some reason.

 

Doesn't seem to be a lot of info out there about them. So please add if you know more or if I got something wrong.

 

These pics belong to a guy named Oscar on car domain. Who has this in his 710. Here is a link to his CD page.

 

Oscar’s Datsun 710

 

 

 

 

[Farmer Joe]

1.8 and only 3 mains? sounds like a forklift motor to me.

 

id say that would prolly get the 59 to going pretty good tho if you put maybe a weber and free flowing exhaust on it.

[sick620]

mexican motors do not sound bueno to me let me tell ya.

[MAG58]

Does the J have the normal oil pump location (bolted to the ass end of the cam) or did Nissan take some personal liberties in their engine design? Also do you know if the flywheel take BLMC specs or is it a Datto flange?

 

Either way, the A series (smaller everything) has made 185hp on that 3 main forklift motor normally aspirated, and turning 9k so anything is possible.

[ggzilla]

the A series (smaller everything) has made 185hp on that 3 main forklift motor normally aspirated, and turning 9k

Are you referring to the Nissan A engine? All A engines used 5-main cranks except the original A10 from 1966. The most powerful stock A engine was the A15E at 93 hp. Forklift motors are somewhere around 45HP with 5-main bearings, but rated for 100% constant power. Racing versions have pushed 200HP.

[fisch]

Mag I wish I had the answers about the clutch and the oil pump. Tough to find info about these engines. I read on ODPL in a few posts by IMH that he used a JDM J16 in a 320. He said:

 

"It has a modified MGB header, a solid breaker plate in the distributor, electric fuel pump, aluminum flex fan, a mild cam and port matching on the head, along with a 280Z clutch, a 200ZX 5 speed, a 3.70 roadster differential, etc."

 

So the 225mm 280z clutch disc and pressure plate will work with a J16. But the J13 needs the 200mm.

 

As I understand it, the BMC B-series 1800 came in a 3 main early on and a 5 main later? The engine above is a 3 main, but it is also in a older 710, so who knows where it came from. Could be from a fork truck. I would like to see inside the Mexican J18 that was in the early 80's 180SXs down there. Wonder if it is like the later BMC 1800 5 main? (Doubtful.) But I read that car was set up for a rotary which didn't pan out, so they went J18 at the last minute. There has to be a diagram somewhere!

[MAG58]

Are you referring to the Nissan A engine? All A engines used 5-main cranks except the original A10 from 1966. The most powerful stock A engine was the A15E at 93 hp. Forklift motors are somewhere around 45HP with 5-main bearings, but rated for 100% constant power. Racing versions have pushed 200HP.

 

 

Nope I'm talking about the BLMC A engine that is the little brother of the BLMC B and thus this engine. It started off as a little 848cc 24hp (on a good day) motor and in it's better stanges of racing has seen twin cam heads, 1600cc's and enough RPM's to make a 4-bolt main SBC cringe. The key to keeping them alive is lots of oil (my A series is 40psi HOT at idle and 75-80 at 1800rpm +) and if you're really running the ever loving hell out of them, getting a main strap over the center cap. If a V6 can push 1000hp on 4 mains, why couldn't a little 4banger push 200 on 3?

 

And the oil pump is most likely where it should be which is bolted to the back of the engine. It sits on the back of the cam, on the outside of the motor, between the block and the flywheel.

Edited December 9, 2009 by MAG58

[fisch]

I wrote a guy in Mexico city that has the 180sx with the J18 to ask some more questions.

 

I invited him to join Ratsun. Hopefully he is reading this an going to join!

 

And i have been told by a few people the 3 main is stronger than people think too! Still if the J18 is a 5, all the more yummy!

[fisch]

Here is a J18 with a 5speed in a Mexican 620 from one of our own members, (The 620).

 

Sadly he is a one time poster.

 

But note the engine mounts are indeed up font by the timing cover. (Way in front of the cross member.)

 

[datsunhead]

how big can a j13 be bored out?

[datsun65]

Spoke with a Nissan Engine/Parts seller in Mexico about 6 months ago. Rebuilt J18 units are available. May be a challenge getting it into the USA , though.

[Zendar]

Here's a picture of an J18 crank, so it came in 3 and 5 main bearing versions like the bmc b's

[fisch]

Here's a picture of an J18 crank, so it came in 3 and 5 main bearing versions like the bmc b's

 

Now that is interesting! I would bet the engine in the 180sx Sakura in Mexico is a 5 bearing then. But who knows.

 

As for bore, assuming the J and the BMC B's are the same (and they appear to be), I have heard of going 60 over on the MGB b-series 1800 and read at least one account (below) of going up to 1950cc, from the original 1795cc. With Lotus pistons.

 

I guess you could do this with an E1 or even my C1?

 

Here is an interesting read on getting an MGB 1800 up to a 1950cc.

http://www.theautoist.com/1950ccengine.htm

 

He also mentions a place that makes pistons to get your 1800 MGB up to 1924 CC. They require NO block decking and can be used with MGB rods.

( I guess the Lotus pistons were a bit of a hassle.)

http://www.mgbmga.com/

[MAG58]

Now that's a crank! The BMC B was only partially counterweighted, so nissan definately improved on the tractor design. BMC Also tended to window (punch a hole out) the area above the middle main bearing for even pressure distrobution in the crankshaft area, if Nissan deleted this rediculous necessity as well it would make for a nice start to produce a relatively bulletproof motor. It may not be a Honda B series or a turbo KA, but lord the sound of a little 4banger on song with shared ports is something that needs to be experienced.

[fisch]

Got some great info from Steve (HP11) who had a JDM J16 in his 320. Indeed it is a 5 main engine! How to ever find one is the question?

 

"J16, Weber 40DCOE, header, dual remote oil filters, 200SX dogleg 5 speed, 3.889 roadster rear end, rear sway bar, urethane bushings..."

 

"I bought it from one of the many importers that were around in 1997. The name of the company is C&T International, Inc., located in Pico Rivera, CA. They're still around but they can't get the J16 anymore. I don't know where you find one nowdays. It's a 5 main bearing engine. I came from a Homer T20 which was a Datsun truck not imported to the US. The 200SX dogleg bolted to it because of the mouning plate that came with it. (Sheer luck!!) It wouldn't have fit the column shift trans without using the mounting plate that goes with the coulmn shift trans as well as the clutch, flywheel, etc. that goes with the column shift trans. I don't know about clearance with the sidedraft/column shift linkage since I never tried that. I had to get a new drive shaft made because of the dogleg trans and the SPL311 differential (3.889) as both yokes were different from the 320. I also had to do some trans mount modification but I don't recall what I did there as it was 12 years ago when I did the swap."

 

[fisch]

More Photos

 

J1600 J16:

 

 

J1800 J18:

[MAG58]

That's it, someone needs to put a monster cam in one with some heavy port work and see what it will throw out.

[Zendar]

I'll throw my J15 to the mix :mellow:

 

[mklotz70]

Fisch....I don't think the motor mounts would be a prob...at least in the NL, the mounts mate to the plate on the front of the motor...which looks to be on the J18.

[fisch]

Fisch....I don't think the motor mounts would be a prob...at least in the NL, the mounts mate to the plate on the front of the motor...which looks to be on the J18.

 

That is what I am hoping Mike! Love the J15 Zender!!

 

Here is the Mexican 200sx Sakura that it came in. Already has a 5speed!

[Zendar]

fisch, you should buy one of those, if they aren't too expensive. ;)

 

I like the j15 also, too bad it's fubard :P c.1 is out of action, burnt valves or something :(

[sparkle]

What I'd like to know, is the difference in bottom ends between J15s and J18s. Is the '18 just a bored out J15 with different rods and pistons?

Obviously has a different crank if its 5 bolt.

 

If that's the case, how bout a bored out J15 block with MGB 1800 crank, rods and pistons?

Or cheat with a MGB block and J15 head?

 

I'm much-o keen-o for a J18 myself... Much to most people's disgust!

[fisch]

You know I never stop thinking about these mysterious J's! Found some video today of a Datsun Samuri w/ the J18 doing some burnouts! At least I assume it is a j18. (That is what is written in the video.) But man there is little info out there of what these came in!

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n8fjyivvROI&feature=channel

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c_BoxlWZWjs&feature=channel

[fisch]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E1KR05GE_sg&feature=channel

[Charlie69]

VG30 Auto that bad little "59", atleast then you could pass cars going up hill! :D